Re: Berries MUST be Nerfed

by TAllenSr
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Re: Berries MUST be Nerfed

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Champion (Retired)

You can't really change it without completely destroying berries.  They're not even overpowered, as you have just stated.

 

The problem is with the zombie players.  Not enough of them are using decks that can defeat berries because instead of responding to the decks that are in play by changing their decks to counter, they expect the game to change around them, so that their favorite deck is still viable.

 

That and I can't tell you just how few players below Platinum use removal cards.  If you actually look through the zombie cards in the game, there are at least two (when considering joint classes) that can be used to counter those cards (strawberrian and strongberry) as they come up.  That means you have double the chance of countering those cards when they come up as they do of having those cards available on the turn.  But again, most zombie players would rather change the game then change their strategy...   ... So, if they don't have the counters in their hand, and berry decks continue to have high win rates because of their (zombie's) refusal to adapt and overcome, then you'll continue to see boring Berry decks in play.

Message 11 of 46 (544 Views)

Re: Berries MUST be Nerfed

Champion (Retired)

There other problem, admittedly, is a lack of imagination from plant players to come up with new and interesting decks when they have the option to just recreate strong ones they see online...  ... Especially when those decks get them wins

Message 12 of 46 (537 Views)

Re: Berries MUST be Nerfed

★★★★★ Apprentice

I can beat them with several decks ... I am just tired of ONLY playing those. If I change, it is hard to beat berries. The funny thing is I created a specific "berry crusher" deck, and when I play that one, somehow I see far fewer berries ... it is like they KNOW! LOL

 

I don't see how raising the sun price on at LEAST Strawberrian to 4 would "destroy the berry decks". I think it should be 4 for Strawberrian and 5 for Strongberry. Or at least limit the max number of extra hits a pair of Strongberries can do. And of course fix the actual BUG that strong berries keep hitting back and forth AFTER they are dead.

 

They made the same change to Valkerie and the mustache fusion bonus attack (sorry can't remember the name) and it did add some balance back to things and those decks were not everywhere after that.

 

But yes, I blame the uncreative, unmotivated berry players more than the devs.

Message 13 of 46 (530 Views)

Re: Berries MUST be Nerfed

Champion (Retired)

Well, think about the cards that are available for okay by the zombies during those turns.  Imagine some of the more perfumes zombie combinations you have and what it would do to raise their cost by one...  It devastates, doesn't it? Especially when you and I can both concede that it isn't even overpowered in the first place.  

 

The main problem, Which can't be remedied is the cost of those cards to create.  Strongberry should be legendary at the very least, but now that those cards are already played by everyone, it's moot.  

 

Which is why I take it back to zombies.  At higher levels, yes, the players have created good counters to the berries, but against lower skilled players, they get amazing results . They have no reason to stop playing them.  It's a hard situation to resolve.  Because again, begging berries makes them completely underpowered, but you also can't make lower skilled players change their style of play either.

 

Honestly, the best we can do is hope for an expansion in the future that shakes things up.

Message 14 of 46 (525 Views)

Re: Berries MUST be Nerfed

★★★★★ Apprentice

But raising the prices of Valkerie and Mustache Platform by one did not ruin those. In fact I have a deck I call "Rocket Opera" that they are the key. I think it would at least be worth trying.

 

I agree that Strongberry should have been Legendary since day one. And that "infinite loop of bonus attacks" never sat right with me. Especially when they still had the bug that allowed them to RESUME ATTACKING after the shield. Luckily they fixed that quick. But like you said, too late for that now.

Message 15 of 46 (518 Views)

Re: Berries MUST be Nerfed

Champion (Retired)

Those were overpowered cards that could help win the game without any answer, though...  There were reasons for those.  Certainly you remember just how strong prof/valk decks were before the nerf!  They're still strong, but balanced now, as opposed to before the nerd...

 

Berry decks are, in fact balanced now.  So raising the cost only makes a balanced deck less effective and underpowered

Message 16 of 46 (514 Views)

Re: Berries MUST be Nerfed

★★★★★ Apprentice

I guess we have to agree to disagree. I don't think Berries are balanced now. Beatable does not equal balanced. It is too easy to wipe out an entire board on rounds 3-4-5 with berries. And if you happen to get some unlucky draws as a zombie, you are toast. The combination of Strawberrian hitting each for one when another berry played, plus the strongberry hitting for an additional 2 is just too much "bonus hits". Add in a second Strongberry and forget about it. Only Legendary cards like Gargantuan Thrower etc can help at that point. It just should not be that easy (translation: no legendary needed) and cheap to build that strong of a deck. There are no other examples like this in the game. The closest would be an Astro-Shroom/Admiral Navy Bean/Planet of the Grapes combo. But that is FAR more beatable than your basic Berry deck.

 

Speaking of ... how the heck are Grapes "berries"? First time a squirrel wrangler destroyed my grape environment I was like, WTH? Tongue out

Message 17 of 46 (505 Views)

Re: Berries MUST be Nerfed

Champion (Retired)

Grapes are technically berries...  Strawberries on the other hand, are not.  Crazy, right?

 

While I would normally agree with your sentiment because of their win loss ratio at lower levels of play, that is brought in by players refusal to adapt and not the core of the mechanics.  Much like I truly believe zombies were not overpowered in series 3, and plants simply refused to adapt....   ... And look at how those nerfs neutered many of those cards.

Message 18 of 46 (500 Views)

Re: Berries MUST be Nerfed

★★★★★ Apprentice

I get it. I have most cards and reach level 50 quickly. But I am tired of only playing Berries. I HAVE adapted - I just don't think I should be forced to play one way to win. Just sad ... another pointer to the dying of this fun game.

Message 19 of 46 (495 Views)

Re: Berries MUST be Nerfed

Champion (Retired)

I completely agree with everything you just said.  I know you can beat them, which makes it ask the more ffrustrating to play them constantly, I really do understand that.  Like I said, I don't believe series 3 was overpowered, but uI wa incredibly tired of playing the same decks constantly, so I feel your pain.

 

It's not bad for plants right now to level of zombies, but the whole game is stuck in a rut.  I see maybe ten different decks constantly (as opposed to just cyclecap, berries and heals), with a few outliers that either blow my mind or are completely terrible.

 

I'm really hoping this delay leads to a few new expansions and creative cards that can truly shake up the meta and open the game up.  I just don't want to see berries nerfed...  Partially because it doesn't need it in my opinion when facing more experienced opposition, but also because I'm one of the originators of the deck lol I posted it back when people thought berries were trash.  Nobody wants to see their baby get unjust treatment!

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