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Re: 22 Asks to please make the game competitive and fun, for once.

by Neo_Novalis
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Original Post

[Suggestion] 22 Asks to please make the game competitive and fun, for once.

[ Edited ]
★ Guide

Please clean up the game by removing or updating the following mechanics:

 

1. Kickoffs: There shouldn't be a way to automatically kick the ball to the full back with zero risk and the reward of 1 out of every 5 times causing a fumble.

 

2. Onsides Kicks: Like kickoffs, this should be more of a dynamic experience that doesn't result in someone spending 15 seconds to call a kickoff play waiting for the other player to blindly select kickoff, only to have to burn a timeout or hope the static onside kick mechanics don't work this time.

 

3. Pass Rush: There's either never a pass rush or there's a glitch pass rush that completely ruins the user experience. The end result is that people min max a few plays that trick out the AI and then force the defensive user to guard the entire field using crossing routes with little fear of actually haven't to throw the ball or "read" much of anything because the players always do the same thing. Passing, Pass Rush, and the general static nature of the game create something that is not football and is more arcade-like. Which may be very satisfying for the average person playing MUT, but alienates people that actually love the game of football and the chess match.

 

4. Hurry Up Offense: Even in the NFL the defense has time to set up against of a hurry up offense. But in Madden it's like 3 seconds and HIKE! It's really kind of insane when you combine that with the static nature of the game. The idea that inside zone can work 6 times in a row all the way down the field because someone chose to call a non-meta defense one time is pretty frustrating. At LEAST give the defense a chance to actually set up and align to the formation the offense is in. 7 seconds before snap at the most. You don't have to run off that much clock, just give the defense some time prior to the offense lining up. Ya know, like have the stinking teams walk up to the line of scrimmage again. I get it, the average gamer has no attention span, but could be please stop making the game less competitive because little jimmy has to get his dopamine fix?

 

5. Wind: Why can't I see what direction the wind is going in ever? An arrow pointed down to the right means what exactly? Do I have the wind? Does my opponent have the wind? WHO KNOWS?! And why do I only get to see that when I'm kicking off? Wouldn't I want to know that BEFORE I choose what side of the field I want to kick to? Spoiler, yes. I should always know what way the wind is blowing. Is it towards my opponent or towards me? That's what I want to know. Not if there's an arrow somewhere pointed towards no reference point, and only during a coin toss or once I'm ready to kick the ball. I want to know ALWAYS on every screen.

 

6. Coaching Suggestions: FOR GOD SAKE, please give me an option to remove coaching suggestions from the play calling screen. In fact, give me the ability to customize the play calling screen so that I never have to see whatever it is I don't want to see ever again. It's 4th and inches and I have 10 seconds to call a play, and I need a touch down to tie the game. Gee thanks Madden for telling me I should call PA Crossers and making me wonder where all the plays I actually want disappeared to.

 

7. Stop selling me a bill of goods: Over the last few years I've noticed a trend in how the game is developed and how it's maintained over the course of the first few months before I ultimately stop playing until next year and you guys lose my money. It starts like this, the game is slower, which is good. The game doesn't allow defensive users to run all over the field and cover 3 receivers at a time, which is also good. The game requires more thoughtfulness and play calling skill than the previous year.

 

Then after little jimmy yells and screams on twitter, the game gets patched and everything goes back to stupidville again. So the first month is usually pretty good, but it all goes down hill (pun intended) as players start min maxing the static mechanics, find glitches, and exploit the same problems that have existed in this game for years. But what really burns me up is when the very things that made the new version of the game better are thrown out the window so people can mindlessly run the game offensive and defensive plays over and over again, and the only thing that matters is that every player on the field have max speed.

 

This is where Regs becomes much more enjoyable to play, costs no extra money, and feels more like the original version of the game than MUT seemingly ever will. This is why every year I wonder why I don't just pick up the standard version of the game and play regs all year. Saving both my money and my mental well being. However, it's MUT that has the more competitive players and that's really the ONLY thing that is driving me playing it. Which is really unfortunately because if you guys could just hold firm and make a balanced game, it might actually be ok. In other words, please stop listening to little jimmy and the "pro" gamers because they're only interested in repeatable non-sense that can be exploited with muscle memory. They're not really interested in football.

 

8. Contains: Why do they never actually work? Ok, I take that back, why when contains work do you update the game and make them not work? Here's my theory, little jimmy wants to run around like an idiot on every play and if you don't let him do that he won't buy MUT packs. Am I right? Is that why some years contains are amazing and you "tone them down" to the point that they no longer work at all?

 

Make no mistake, I just want balance. I just want little jimmy to actually have to think about how he's going to navigate a pocket where the defense is actively trying to contain him. I don't want QB's to no longer roll out or be able to scramble, it should be a skill though, like anything else.

 

9. Soggy Fries: I'm sure some people order fries and want/expect them to soggy, but I don't. In fact, I dare say most people don't. Fries are supposed to be crisp, which is why they're cooked in an air crisper. If you bought an air crisper and it made soggy fries, what would the review for that product be like? 1 out of 5 stars. So why is Madden making so many soggy fries? In other words, why doesn't Madden play more like a football game and less like a glitchy arcade fighting game where all you need to know is what play breaks the AI? Stop making soggy fries.

 

Example: Inside Stuff. It's not football if one guy is always playing "zone" or "dive" plays like a hall of famer but can't play the same way on read option or lead block power plays. It's arcade-like. Similarly, making running plays like inside zone so over powered that you are forced to pinch your d-line on every play is equally problematic. At the very least inside stuff should not work against double teams, and inside zone should not be a magic running play that can only be defended against one way.

 

10. Need more visual queues: How do I know when I'm in run commit or pass commit? There's no visual queue confirming it. How do I know if I'm in over the top or underneath coverage? How do I know?

 

11. Stupid buttons: Why would anyone want to have the touch pass and the lob pass on the same button? Why would anyone want to have the dive and the slide play on the same button? This is just crazy. It's hard enough to try to use these controls in the middle of a play but to also complicate it so you wanted to slide but instead you dive and fumble the ball is just not fun. You know exactly what you want to do, you're being careful and smart, but you can't press the button physically the right way to make that happen. Please find another way to do this. There's never been a person in real life that wanted to slide but instead dove. Or that wanted to throw a touch pass but instead lobbed it up into the air. Never, not once.

 

12. The people playing this game are not Pat Mahomes: I understand that Mahomes and Rodgers, etc. are being simulated, but we're going overboard by letting players play QB and not read defenses or set their feet, or ever have a pass rush. Could you please make people DO SOMETHING more than one read and throw the football at exactly the right time knowing that some guy is going be open on a corner route every play? The QB should have to move around the pocket, read coverage during the play, and not get the exact same reaction from the DB's and LB's over and over again.

 

13. People playing deep coverage all game: I rarely see my receivers get open deep. Even when I watch the recording of the game afterwards. There are multiple reasons for this. Mainly the overemphasis on speed, and the meta defenses of MUT. But the most significant reason is because of the way Madden defenses react to play action passing, the running game, and misdirection. It "sounds" like some of that is being tuned for Madden 22, but historically this hasn't translated well into actionable or meaningful results. It all has to work together to be balanced.

 

For example: If someone dude is running contains all game, the running lanes inside the tackle should be huge! A TE should be kicking out on that defensive end and making them pay for running a contain. At least, that should be the net average of what happens, anyway. There should still be outliers to avoid static play.

 

14. Lob and Touch Passing: These are not very meaningful ways to pass the ball. The touch pass is poorly defined, and should be rethought to give actual purpose to this type of passing. In the tutorial it states it the touch pass is used to throw over defenders that are between the QB and the receiver. But in the game the defender simply jumps up and intercepts the ball. I think the touch pass should either negate that jumping animation of defenders or be used in a way that increases certain passes of being completed or led down the field (screen passes, wheel, and swing routes, for example).

 

15. I wish the passing cone would've worked: I understand the passing cone was a failure. But the development was still thinking in the right direction. How about making it so the QB can't see the receiving icons unless they're facing the direction they want to throw? No passing cone needed, and you could still add a vision skill into the game. But this would make it easier for the defense to read the QB eyes and make a play on the ball. The player could still memorize the buttons and throw to the other players if they weren't looking at them, but the throws would be less effective. I think this would help tone down a lot of the chaotic plays that people use to abuse the AI.

 

16. Fatigue: Everything I posted here is important to me. But this one holds a special importance. Fatigue is baked into football, it's a fundamental aspect of the game. And one of the reasons you don't want to score 1 play touch downs is because it makes your defense stay out on the field longer and they become less effective. This type of fatigue is never represented in MUT, and I understand why because little jimmy doesn't think that's fun. Well I don't think it's fun that I can hold the ball for 14 play drives and the defense is fully charged every play. Fatigue should be fairly represented, it would make team building more important, and it would make teams less cookie cutter. Maybe some people would think twice about having all super fast guys on the field if they couldn't sustain playing at a high level for the whole game where the opponent used a ball control offense. Maybe it would also force people using the meta defenses to guard against every deep route to play up once in a while so that they could try to get their defense off the field. Again, it all has to work together. If you allow one type of playing style to dominate, you're not really playing football you're playing an arcade game.

 

17. Don't do this: Some of your marketing material mentions being able to change abilities at half time. That sounds like the dumbest thing I've ever heard. That sounds like you're telling everyone that made a running team that is successful, that at halftime your opponent is going to get to put inside stuff on their entire d-line and stop your team that was specifically designed to run inside. What did the coaches tell them? "Hey guys, I just thought it would be important for you to stop getting mowed down by a physically superior team on inside runs, so I magically gave you the ability to shed all their blocks". DUMB! Please don't do this. This makes zero sense. Whoever came up with this idea is either a marketing guy or some little jimmy "pro" gamer that wants an easy button.

 

18. Kicking: Why is it so easy? And why does everyone use the same two or three kickers in MUT? Just having a Power and Accuracy rating in Madden is not working. You need to come up with a new way to make kickers more unique, and you need to make sure that no kickers are bullet proof. They all need to have some weaknesses, SOMETHING, that players have to contend with. This actually goes to the heart of the ratings for all players.

 

19. Ratings System Stinks: The game has evolved and the ratings system needs to evolve with it. MUT players are all amazing at some point, and that takes away from the strategy of the game. It dumbs down the game to the least common denominator. Which is why the first month of MUT is by far my favorite time to play. Because most players have real weaknesses in their game. One guy might play man really well but not zone. One guy might be a great pass blocker but just an average run blocker. We need a lot more of that. Emphasis on A LOT MORE.

 

Example: Deion Sanders. That dude could never tackle. He was famous for not tackling. He didn't want to do it. He probably couldn't do it. But you guys don't really punish him for that the way you should. I mean, he's so incredible as a DB (and for good reason) but he shouldn't be good at tackling, even as a 99. Which brings up another point.

 

20. Speed is overpowered and there's no cost to it: Once you guys removed the salary cap for MUT it all went down hill. Sure, you could sell more packs, congratulations. But why couldn't you sell more packs and still have the salary cap? There's got to be a way. You control the entire market. If a dude has 99 speed and can't be covered by anyone on the field, why do we need to have an arms race of 99 speed guys? Can't we play a game where DB's an actually cover 99 speed guy by backing up? Or can't we put less value on speed so that it's more competitive and everyone doesn't have to have the same players? Again, I think the problem here is a lack of imagination, certainly from the customers, but also from the dev team. Tyreek Hill is really good and very difficult to stop, but he's just a person. If you double team him and one guy plays the deep routes while the other guy plays middle crossing routes, his stats go way down in real life. But in Madden he just runs by both guys and they can't catch him. It's pretty frustrating to know that by default you have to have 99 speed Tyreek Hill to be competitive. This has to change, and the only way to do this is to put less value in speed, uplift the other ratings, and provide some tools for defenses to clamp down on the obvious plays that are run over and over again. (the ones based almost purely on speed)

 

Salary cap was cool, I loved it. I wish this was part of the competitive play again. It was painful seeing it gone last year. Little jimmy was probably really happy though, so there is that. Also, putting playing out of position is just killing this game. Sure, it's one thing if offensive lineman actually maul all those little guys but I really doubt they will, because people are going to cry. But in the event you guys actually hold firm on this and it's working for M22, I hope you stick with it because it's vital to a healthy game. And that's where salary cap comes back into this conversation. If people can just use an endless amount of players they'll just adjust their lineup with other studs that can handle the offensive line. Which is really sad that we'd let these guys min/max the game to death so they never have normal trade offs. 

 

21. Develop a Library of Common Knowledge: You've changed this game around for years and even though I follow it fairly closely, I still don't know the way everything works. You need to develop a library of common knowledge that documents the intent of all the gameplay functionality, what works, why it might not work, what changed from last year, what all the controls are, etc. The gridiron notes are not sufficient. I honestly shouldn't have to google it and read reddit forums, or look at rando youtube videos. There should be an authoritative place to go that tells me exactly how to play this game. There are literally features or residual features in this game that don't work but still have UI or old mechanics from years ago. When I try to look up how something works it's a huge guessing game. People say all kinds of stuff on the internet and sometimes it's correct and sometimes it's nonsense. Please take some of your billions and hire someone to develop and maintain a site that has authoritative guidance on how the game actually works, what the working and supported features are, and what the known bugs are.

 

In addition, please regularly provide a list of the top 10 plays (offensive and defensive) that are being used in the wild. This will help people develop strategies against them prior to being lit up. It will also help get feedback from the community on what is being abused, etc.

 

22. Weekend League is lame: I have a full-time job, a family, and other responsibilities. I really don't have time to play 25 freakin games every week. And I question who does have that kind of time? Although I know the answer to that question already. There's simply too many games. Sure, I can string together a weekend or two where I play that much, but it's such a grind that you really have to end up devoting your life to MUT if you're going to try to play competitively, and that's lame. It's not that good of a game to do that, unfortunately. And even though I might try from time to time, it's not sustainable if you have any type of life.

 

Please come up with a format that makes more sense for people with jobs, family, a life, mental health, etc. Whatever makes weekend league require less games, I'm all for that.

 

That's all for now.

 

[EDIT: added "Suggestion" to the thread title to make it more visible for other players if they want to support your great suggestions]

Message 1 of 9 (260 Views)

Re: 22 Asks to please make the game competitive and fun, for once.

Community Manager

@WereRobber 

 

Thanks for taking the time to post your extensive feedback, we do appreciate it.

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Message 2 of 9 (235 Views)

Re: 22 Asks to please make the game competitive and fun, for once.

★ Guide

Thank you. I really should've proof read that before I posted. Standard smile

 

One more thing. For Esports, you guys should develop a broadcasting mode where the game can be both played and broadcasted so that it is much easier to consume. I'd love to watch madden games where we could get multiple angles of play (not see the UI or play art), see instant replays, etc. I think it would really help the average fan watch these games on Twitch, Youtube, TV, etc. Now that the next gen consoles are here, I'm guessing this might be possible over time. M23?

 

Also, I listened to Clint on the Madden Podcast yesterday and (as always) he got me excited to play the new game. I didn't play the beta this year because I was very close to just opting out of the whole thing. But it's hard for me to stay away when I hear about gameplay fixes and new features that should have a positive impact. As stated above, it's really only when the patches start toning everything down that we seem to revert back to the status quo and progress stops being made. I really hope this year can be different.

 

For example, I'm positive that screen passes will be considered over powered this year, just by hearing Clint talk about them. And maybe they will need to be toned down "some" but if the end result is that they revert back to pass years that's a loss. We need to move this game forward. We need a pass rush and running lanes. We need so much more than what we currently have.

 

In the competitive fighting community there's a term used to describe the counter move you should make when your opponent does something over and over again. It's call punishment. You're supposed to PUNISH that style of play because if you allow them to keep doing it they will run all over you, they will be comfortable, they will win. We need a lot more punishing mechanics in Madden. There shouldn't be an unpunishable meta. Like inside zone, or inside stuff, or max protect throw to crossing routes, or 3-3-5 wide middle linebacker covering 3/4 of the field. We need balance, and we need the ability to punish repetitive play.

 

 

Message 3 of 9 (226 Views)

Re: 22 Asks to please make the game competitive and fun, for once.

Community Manager

@WereRobber wrote:

Please clean up the game by removing or updating the following mechanics:

 

1. Kickoffs: There shouldn't be a way to automatically kick the ball to the full back with zero risk and the reward of 1 out of every 5 times causing a fumble.

 

2. Onsides Kicks: Like kickoffs, this should be more of a dynamic experience that doesn't result in someone spending 15 seconds to call a kickoff play waiting for the other player to blindly select kickoff, only to have to burn a timeout or hope the static onside kick mechanics don't work this time.

 


Regarding kickoffs, do you think if there was a chance for a player to fumble on the kickoff from squib kick then teams would always do it? In real life the players on special teams don't have the hands the kickoff return specialists do, so realistically you're probably spot on with their increased chance of fumbling. From a game balance perspective, I think it's important to avoid increasing the chances of fumbles in this case or you'll start to see onside kicks or squib kicks so often it doesn't represent an authentic game of football.

I agree with you on onside kicks. I've seen some feedback from players over the years how there should be a wider variety of formations to choose from. Instead of pressing the button to initiate the kick, press again top stop the power, and again for the accuracy, I think an actually flick of the right stick down and up would be a fun way to do it. What do you think about adding a short timer to select your kickoff formation and then having the computer automatically kick it if the player doesn't do it in X amount of time? It already does it where they will kick the ball out of bounds, but for my personal opinion it is a little too long and slows down the game. 

I'd be nice to see the camera angle drop down a little bit closer to the kick off returner if the game was in the 4th quarter in a pivotal kickoff moment. With the crowds going wild, dropping the camera closer into the player to add some more intensity is a feature I'm requesting. You mentioned broadcasting on your other reply. For presentation, if the game gets tied up in the 4th quarter with less than 4 minutes left I'd love to see the stadium's fans all get up on their feet and start making a bunch of noise. I've been to some NFL games myself, it gets rowdy! 

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Re: 22 Asks to please make the game competitive and fun, for once.

★ Guide

@EA_Blueberry wrote:

Regarding kickoffs, do you think if there was a chance for a player to fumble on the kickoff from squib kick then teams would always do it? In real life the players on special teams don't have the hands the kickoff return specialists do, so realistically you're probably spot on with their increased chance of fumbling. From a game balance perspective, I think it's important to avoid increasing the chances of fumbles in this case or you'll start to see onside kicks or squib kicks so often it doesn't represent an authentic game of football.


Game balance is always my primary concern, and I agree that having a significant chance to fumble an onside kick would result in unwanted game choices. However, that's really where we are right now with kickoffs to the fullback. So something has to change there. Just to be clear, I'm talking about players performing a sky kick to the full back and then using a hit stick to cause a fumble. The risk is extremely low, on average the fullback gains about 5 more yards than a normal kickoff, and the potential reward is possession of the football. Just a quick google search, but looks like the average success rate for an onside kick is 20% when teams expect it, and 60% when they don't. Currently Madden is probably more like 5% when they expect it and 30% when they don't. But there aren't a lot of options that influence the outcome.

 

I think it would be interesting to use a rock, paper, scissors approach, here (receiving team play call versus kicking team play call). You could call an onside kick pre-snap and if you get the right look you want kick it for the higher percentage. Of course it's only fair if the receiving team can bait you into it. The risk versus reward being that whatever you're prepared for if the other team chooses a counter move you're at more risk of a bad outcome. Maybe that's a big run back or a fumble or something else. But that's how it works in real life, and that's what I'd like to simulate in Madden.


@EA_Blueberry wrote:

I agree with you on onside kicks. I've seen some feedback from players over the years how there should be a wider variety of formations to choose from. Instead of pressing the button to initiate the kick, press again top stop the power, and again for the accuracy, I think an actually flick of the right stick down and up would be a fun way to do it. What do you think about adding a short timer to select your kickoff formation and then having the computer automatically kick it if the player doesn't do it in X amount of time? It already does it where they will kick the ball out of bounds, but for my personal opinion it is a little too long and slows down the game. 


I feel like the expired timer kicking out of bounds was really just a band-aid for people griefing on kickoffs, and it's time to rethink a more sophisticated solution.

 

I always love it when the ball goes out of bounds though. Starting at the 40 is great.


@EA_Blueberry wrote:
I'd be nice to see the camera angle drop down a little bit closer to the kick off returner if the game was in the 4th quarter in a pivotal kickoff moment. With the crowds going wild, dropping the camera closer into the player to add some more intensity is a feature I'm requesting. You mentioned broadcasting on your other reply. For presentation, if the game gets tied up in the 4th quarter with less than 4 minutes left I'd love to see the stadium's fans all get up on their feet and start making a bunch of noise. I've been to some NFL games myself, it gets rowdy! 

 

I like that idea, too. I hope they do it.

 

I'd also like to see the FG kicks spiced up a bit more too. Maybe having odd angles where it's just harder in general to kick field goals than it is right now. I think the camera angle on field goals should be based a lot more on which hash the ball is spotted on. So if you're a right footed kicker trying to make a long kick spotted on the opposite hash, I'd really like to see that camera angle be extreme and lure you into over compensating, resulting in a wide left or wide right. Again, this happens in the real games all the time. Would be nice to see some Next Gen Stats on which kickers may have issues with one type of kick versus another. Ideally, all kickers would have some type of weakness that would need to be overcome each ball game. No more of this picking Morton Anderson and knowing you can make 60 yard field goals with ease.

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Re: 22 Asks to please make the game competitive and fun, for once.

★ Guide

Here's a quick and dirty mock up of the kicking logic I'd like to see:

 

Rock Paper Scissors Kicking Mechanic:

 

Kicking Team Options (1 of 3):


1. Kickoff.
Choice 1: Left.
Choice 2: Middle.
Choice 3: Right

 

2. Fake Kickoff (surprise onside kick!) 60% chance of success if receiving team is not alert:
Choice 1: Dribble kick over the middle where the kicker tries to field the ball.
Risk: If the receiving team is alert (20% chance of success, see below for more details) the kick will be recovered, and could be run back for a bigger return or even a TD!
Reward: Possession of the football goes to the kicking team.

 

Choice 2: Line Drive Kick to the Left, with the hopes that it will bounce off a player or go 10 yards for recovery. 60% chance of success if receiving team is not alert:
Risk: If the receiving team is alert (20% chance of success, see below for more details) the ball could go out of bounds on receiving teams own 40-45 yard line (and a 10 yard penalty would be added), the kick could be recovered by the receiving team, and could be run back for a bigger return or even a TD!
Reward: Possession of the football goes to the kicking team.

 

Choice 3: Line Drive Kick to the Right, with the hopes that it will bounce off a player or go 10 yards for recovery. 60% chance of success if receiving team is not alert:
Risk: If the receiving team is alert (20% chance of success, see below for more details) the ball could go out of bounds on receiving teams own 40-45 yard line (and a 10 yard penalty would be added), the kick could be recovered by the receiving team, and could be run back for a bigger return or even a TD!
Reward: Possession of the football goes to the kicking team.

 

3. Traditional Onside Kick (no surprise, 5-35% chance of success, see below for more details): All plays can be flipped left or right.
Choice 1: Short Lob Kick over the head of the front line of the receiving team.
Choice 2: Spinning dribble kick towards the middle of the field.
Choice 3: Big hop kick that is intended to go 10 yards and cause a fumble.
Risks: Similar to what is listed above.

 

Receiving team options:

 

1. Traditional Kickoff Coverage.
Choice 1: Left.
Choice 2: Middle.
Choice 3: Right.

 

2. Defend Onside kick alert middle (not surprised, well scouted!):
Choice 1: Defend against dribble kick over the middle where the kicker tries to field the ball. 80-95% chance of success if kicking team calls this play. 60% chance of success if alert but do not call the exact defense.
Risk: If the kicking team calls a traditional kickoff your receiving team is less prepared for the return and there is a higher chance of a big run back.

 

Choice 2: Defend Onside kick alert Left (not surprised, well scouted!): 80-95% chance of success if kicking team calls this play. 60% chance of success if alert but do not call the exact defense.
Risk: If the kicking team calls a traditional kickoff your receiving team is less prepared for the return and there is a higher chance of a big run back.

 

Choice 3: Defend Line Drive Kick to the Right, with the hopes that it will bounce off a player or go 10 yards for recovery. 80-95% chance of success if kicking team calls this play. 60% chance of success if alert but do not call the exact defense.
Risk: If the kicking team calls a traditional kickoff your receiving team is less prepared for the return and there is a higher chance of a big run back.

 

3. Traditional On-side Kick Coverage:

Choice 1: Defend Short Lob Kick over the head of the front line of the receiving team.
Choice 2: Defend Spinning dribble kick towards the middle of the field.
Choice 3: Defend Big hop kick that is intended to go 10 yards and cause a fumble.
Risks: Similar to what is listed above.

 

Again, quick and dirty. The percentages have not all been worked out exactly but this should give you a good idea of what type of play I'm thinking about. It's about play calling, gamesmanship, and risk versus reward. If some player wants to kick onside kicks all the time against an alert defense and only get a 5-25% chance of getting the ball back, I'd say that's inline with real life and reasonable risk vs. reward expectations in a competitive game.

Message 6 of 9 (187 Views)

Re: 22 Asks to please make the game competitive and fun, for once.

@WereRobber thank you for these great suggestions! I just found the time to read them in detail and I fully agree with all of them! I therefore also tried to summarise / break them down to single suggestions to be able to add them to the Madden 22 Suggestions Index  and make each of them more visible for other players too.

____________________________________________________________________________________
        Positive Play - Feel the emotions, but be aware what they are telling you!
Joy: you like it! Anger: you don't like it! Frustration: you don't like it but cannot do
     anything against it! Aggression: you don't like it and want to break something.
____________________________________________________________________________________
                   Tell everybody (@joy), give constructive feedback (@anger),
                    ask for help (frustration), and have a break (@aggression)!
                     I try to help out other players, but I'm not an EA employee

Message 7 of 9 (171 Views)

Re: 22 Asks to please make the game competitive and fun, for once.

Community Manager
@WereRobber

Awesome submission!

I've love to have the sky high kick on the standard on-side kick like what they do now. If the ball goes up in the air and players from each side get close enough, would be fun to have a button action sequence take place in a slow mo animation.

Random buttons from the controller will pop up and whoever presses them all successfully will come up with the recovery.


My BIGGEST concern with this whole take on increasing more features for onside kicks is experiencing more poor outcomes than never existed. Right now, players aren't that successful performing onside kicks so when it does happen, it's definitely a surprise.

If we had a rock paper scissors scenario, I'm concerned a player could get lucky 3 times in a row and immediately go up 21 points on a player. At that point, you'll see more players quit matches. Does that represent an authentic NFL experience every time you sit down? That will be the area the team would have to really balance it out.

If I had it my way, I would only allow onside kicks in the 2nd and 4th quarter. Perhaps the kickoff following halftime if you're the team falling behind. That is where the surprise kick-off can come into play. Adding more sounds great, but needs limitations in my opinion.
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Message 8 of 9 (157 Views)

Re: 22 Asks to please make the game competitive and fun, for once.


@EA_Blueberry I'd love to have the sky high kick on the standard on-side kick like what they do now. If the ball goes up in the air and players from each side get close enough, would be fun to have a button action sequence take place in a slow mo animation.

 

Random buttons from the controller will pop up and whoever presses them all successfully will come up with the recovery.

My BIGGEST concern with this whole take on increasing more features for onside kicks is experiencing more poor outcomes than never existed. Right now, players aren't that successful performing onside kicks so when it does happen, it's definitely a surprise.


I'd guess that this idea could be further developed to avoid poor / unrealistic outcomes. For instance, if the player of the kicking team faces a shorter time window (and/or has to press the right key (randomly chosen from various keys popping up directly after the onside kick)) to trigger a successful catch or recovery of the ball, while the receiving team has only one (and always the same) key to trigger the catch/recovery and has a bit more time to react, it should be possible to balance the mechanism to have realistic success rates for onside kicks. If none of the players presses the right key on time, it should be even easier to come up with success rates similar to the NFL.

 

Moreover, I think it should also be possible to add a surprise factor to this concept (i.e. different time windows for a successful reaction and a different number of possible buttons). If the receiving team is not prepared for an onside kick, the time window to react could be shortened for the receiving team; and/or alternatively, the player controlling the receiving team might have to chose the right button (from two different alternatives that might pop up on the screen) to successfully react to the onside kick.

 

and finally one more thought: in order to avoid the worst case scenario of three successful onside kicks in a row, it might also be an option to reduce the likelihood of successfully triggering a recovery/catch for the player controlling the kicking team after a successful onside kick (even more if the team had two or more successful onside kicks in the game already). Considering that special teamers (of the receiving team) might be more focused and react better if they got already caught by an onside kick, it might be realistic that they are more likely to avoid a second successful onside kick. 

 

anyways, I really like the ideas discussed in this thread! Standard smile

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