December 2019 - last edited December 2019
@jumanjaydazedLmao your so right about that ive been tempted to remove my stats or just use season 1 ones then nobody will know how good or bad I am :0 (imo BAD)
December 2019 - last edited December 2019
@JiboTVYou took mine and @DoYaSeeMe’s posts too personally I understand your mad about SBMM but we are just saying what we see other players say or what we see based off of streamers and others views not necessarily your own
Like Im not saying that you are upset your not popping those 20-25+ kill games every other game but some players out there probally are upset about that especially streamers who worry about their reputation but also content for their channel like staycation mentioned in a video how he wants to get good content for us to watch and how sweaty the matches are currently but wether he wins or loses its still great content to watch imo even if its only about 10-15 kills compared to those 27+ or so kill games he usually gets
I also see your point of view where your unable to solo queue or play with your friends anymore and are just not enjoying the game at all anymore I do agree something needs fixed but I also don’t fully agree with players that are able to get 20+ kill games every other match to be in casual without some form of ranked play in casual either I want everyone to have a good gaming experience but not exactly sure what needs to be done to do so
Once again Im not necessarily saying you are one of those doing 20-30 kill games every match, i know nothing about you, but Im sure alot of predators or plat/diamonds are able to do so and that dosnt happen often in the current SBMM for whatever rank division Im in people usually win with around 10 kills max occasionally 10-15 I mean I won a game as kill leader with 7 and 9 kills so its not any wheres close to how it was before SBMM was implemented but those 7-9 killl games were just luck for me I still die alot in the new matchmaking against players around my skill level
December 2019
I posted this around but lets go again.
The most obvious problem is when i get into higher tier lobbies i get 2 teammates with lower then 50 lvl which becomes useless at this level. So basically the game expects me to 1v3 the whole lobby of equally skilled players which in most cases impossible.
I understand low tier players frustration about constantly getting smacked by 20k kill players but ranked is here for that as well. If you want to be in the same skill bracket you can just go there or you can be matched against anyone it depends on your luck. But still i think the low tier bracket should be 1-30 lvl matchmaking and 30-100 lvl, this said if the game sees a (ex.)15k/d 1-100 player, send them up so they wont have encouragement to smurf. Then you will have the players maybe not the same skill level but same experience level, so if you are bad at this point you should spend 5 min of your daily time to aim train or watch a stream to improve yourself.
Level 100+ should be just random matchmaking or with the new level system which caps at 500 you can seperate a little more once you look at the data and you see you have enough player to seperate brackets.
For me the most important failiure at SBMM is the players that are in between being a top tier player and above average player ( which is me ). Here is my situation at this game; I barely reached Diamond rank mostly solo queing and when i reach diamond i see fully stacked predator teams ripping me apart, which is fine. I understand my skill level and i say okay i dont belong here. So i go back to normal lobbies right? Okay well the same thing happens in my normal lobbies, i am being matched with top tier players again with my lvl20-50 teammates which i can not enjoy, its not because i cant stomp on people, its because i cant kill anyone!
Imagine this; you are playing a single player game which you love to play. You are progressing slowly and getting better and the next day you want to play the game says you can only player the most hardcore mode in the game. You say okay lets go, then you get destroyed and there is no way for you to progress in the game. So will this game be fun for you anymore? You get in, get destroyed and you cant progress an inch.. How long are you going to play this?
At this point you decide to do smurf and that is the only way if you want to play the game. Then you destroy the newcommers and low tier lobbies. Once Sbmm throws you to higher tier players, go ranked. Destroy bronze to plat lobbies. And this is not fair for the playerbase, its not fair for me either (Its the only way i can enjoy the game meanwhile i have no progression in my main account, i cant use my skins but there is no other way). This is also very bad for Respawn because then i wont be buying skins for my smurf account for sure and i will not be buying new skins for my main account because i cant even play.
Then there is the point which i cant play with my real life friends because their skill level varies. I have a friend who is hearing impaired, he cant hear with his right ear and even though he cant play very good, i love to play with him. Now i cant because he gets destroyed in every single game with me. He cant find people on discords as well because of his handicap, now i either have a smurf to play with him and not leave him alone or i just dont play. This is also not fair.
I agree that solution to this is not easy once it comes to playing with your friends. Still, i think it would be fair if we were just thrown in a random lobby with 100lvl+ and no sbmm. But i think you can relate to my problem.
December 2019
@RwFinfrock wrote:@highOctane91prem
They have discouraged players from spending money indirectly
Not sure how many people have noticed but the ranked system is highly dependent on matches played. Just make a smurf account to see it. So far I have seen 3 lower skill tiers of gameplay as I've built my new account in the recent week.
This is the only way I have been able to enjoy the game over the course of the last few weeks.
To clarify, I'm not attempting to destroy new players. My only intention is to prevent my friends from having to play up to my regular lobby's skill level.
I certainly have no intention of buying anything on a secondary account which will only be used until I am placed in predator lobbies again.
Thanks for your response, I appreciate you taking the time to comment. An important aspect of this game was to be able to find a squad randomly to have a ball with and play with friends (New and old.). Your experience seems to be a consistent one for players on the higher tier rankings in the casual SBMM system. Making a new free account is a common thing for people who just want to experience the game seemingly without the SBMM and to play with friends.
I think people are deliberately misconstruing why people like us are making an appeal to change. But what we can learn from on a more critical note is that some people have a black and white perspective on the SBMM. Some people think it is only good. Some people think it is only bad. I'm hope this discussion analyzes and encourages an approach to the middle-ground between the two.
December 2019 - last edited December 2019
@mastiffslinger Avoiding quoting here due to size, but yes. My initial experience to the game was with a primary focus on solo queuing. Sometimes things worked out, sometimes not. That was the nature of BR. I believe that clarity and explanations from the developers as to how the SBMM works may be insightful to players who are experiencing 'something' but cannot quite put their finger on what. Not understanding why games feel bad versus the last time you played or when you play with your friends can lead to you just up and leaving the game as a result of the poor experience and lack of understanding. Something past a "We're working on it.", or in this case a complete silence would provide clarity for so many players I believe, and I hope the developers have an interest in providing that clarity.
Personally for me, I wasn't always the predator level player I am now. I worked to get to this point, I looked at streamers and other good players (That killed me.) and was like "Man, I really wanna try to beat them! Even once!", because of how good and aware they were. Some people find it harder to relate to this experience and I can understand that, so I am trying to help people to understand that you may not think "I want to beat these other people." for whatever reason, but you do get better the more you play, practice, and watch others. Regardless of how you think, the fact is that as you get better, you get in tougher lobbies and cannot play with friends who do not play as good or as much (Depending.). You also will find solo queues to be tougher to an unplayable degree at times as a result, it's has surprisingly little difference than solo queuing into a ranked match.
I agree the variance was something people could appreciate. The reality was that people of a diamond or predator (And even platinum.) level make up such a smaller amount of the overall population but played more. So seeing them every three to five games happened but didn't feel unbearable. I think people of all levels of play need to appreciate what someone who enjoys playing this game has to say about changes that discourages them from enjoying it. This isn't me whining or complaining about a lack of noob crushing or anything of that nature and I think people are misguided when they feel that is the impression my post gives. Thank you for your insight! I'll take a look at the Reddit post.
December 2019
@DoYaSeeMe It was a dig and I addressed it as such. It also insinuated a lot about my character without acknowledging the substance of my proposition. I never brought up how often you use the forum or how it is relevant? I am sure there are people who have made posts offering no recommendations or just complaining about more benign, low priority, or high variance issues in the past. This, however, is not a post about an issue of high variance. I am not nonsensically complaining, I would say this issue is a higher priority, and I am offering what this particular forum board encourages. That is critical feedback and discussion regarding the game's current state. I think my approach in this post has been beyond reproach and very reasonable, I fail to see why you want to compare it to thousands of people posting "I'm not having fun because of X." given the clear effort I put in to do exactly not that.
So by calling it a plague, you acknowledge SBMM is problematic? Also, I'm sure there is some irony in that idea, but I'd still say your initial understanding is more ironic. Some people do look for things to criticize even when they it isn't that big of a deal. But I consider myself pretty reasonable, an avid gamer, and a fan of Apex. I am not looking to hate or do anything else you suggested in your initial posted response. My thoughts are my own and expressed in my post / responses and seem to be reflected by the community at some level, perhaps you aren't being charitable to the fact some players are not able to articulate or understand why they feel a certain way as well as someone like me? You sound cynical to the nature of what allowing open feedback causes.
December 2019
@FaIIenAngeI777 I do not think you read my response. I clearly addressed your response. Instead of underplaying my response as me being "Mad about SBMM." or taking things too personally, which it and my post were not doing, how about you address what I said? It seems really cheap to ignore my entire response when I did the fine liberty of going through yours yet talk to me from a high horse.
I mentioned this to @DoYaSeeMe as well, my views are the ones I have expressed here. And they seem to be reflected by the community. Comparing my views and the substance of my argument to what some random streamer you disagree with said isn't discussing my post. It is irrelevant to this post based on how you brought it in. You could go talk in that streamer's chat if you wanna try your hand at arguing against that idea.
I never said I don't enjoy the game at all. I expressed I felt punished, in fact I actually said the opposite of what you are saying. You really should read my initial post, man. Here is a snippet if you don't want to read it all "I enjoy this game and want to keep playing, but my time played the last month or so has been steadily declining as a result of this experience. I cannot see myself playing as much alone or with a team as things stand.". I am going to be very generous and express what you are saying clearly. You say you don't agree with higher skill players being in average skill lobbies (No SBMM enabled.) because they are too good. I think you are looking at things backwards if your goal is for people to have a good experience. I'd advise you to read my recommendation again and try to understand how it may encourage people on the lower end and allow them more time to grow. You would need to bear in mind that as a result of doing this recommendation that you would be much more likely to run into higher skill players past the threshold I suggest. So a lower threshold might be better that what I suggest. -
"If I were to make a recommendation, it would be to scrap the higher end of SBMM. Limit SBMM to apply to those on the lower end of rankings. Imagine if we were all ranked by numbers ranging from 1-100, players rank 30 or below would be matched to players of a similar skill level, but once you reach any ranking above 30, you would match with anyone within the range of ranks 31-100. A battle royale game should be a game with a disparity in skill, only one team can win. I understand that encouraging a healthy environment for new players is important, so this is my recommendation with that in mind. "
On your final point, I am not even sure what you are responding to. But regardless, I explained how you could understand how our experiences differ in a response to someone else. This isn't about being able to just max out on kills. -
"In this game you can make mistakes. When you peak someone with an R-99 and miss half your shots, you have a higher chance at staying alive the lower your SBMM ranking. But, as your rank increases, you will be punished more and more for every bullet you miss. Now realize that this game isn't just about missing half your R-99 shots, but also healing, rotating, coordinating with your team, timing, etc.
If I have to focus so hard to not make a mistake in so many areas given how high my ranking is, don't you think you can understand how that might be exhausting? How that makes solo-queuing impossible? How that seems like an anti-casual experience? ".
December 2019
Haha, that's an interesting proposition. It might help some people not feel as intimidated. But I think it runs counter to how Apex developers probably want the game to look and people to feel about their stats. I think I agree that people would likely be happier if they only saw badges or didn't see any kill leader banners.
December 2019
"At this point you decide to do smurf and that is the only way if you want to play the game. Then you destroy the newcommers and low tier lobbies. Once Sbmm throws you to higher tier players, go ranked. Destroy bronze to plat lobbies. And this is not fair for the playerbase, its not fair for me either (Its the only way i can enjoy the game meanwhile i have no progression in my main account, i cant use my skins but there is no other way). This is also very bad for Respawn because then i wont be buying skins for my smurf account for sure and i will not be buying new skins for my main account because i cant even play."
Thank you for your insight! I'll refrain from quoting entirely due to the size of your post. I have responded to many similar posts here, but yours is interesting because it does touch on the game being harder to monetize as a result of people's response to their lobbies feeling bad. Smurfs don't buy skins, and they don't play on their main so they aren't incentivized to purchase skins as much.
This is a very insightful comment about how earning potential can decrease as a result of players getting fed up and realizing they can just make another account for the time being. Thanks!
December 2019