The fraud that is NFS:NL [ Edited ]

[leaderone_gr]

I have to post this research here after being told by support that my concerns should be posted on their facebook page instead of handling the problem properly.

I've been playing this game since last year, got to level 74 and bought some of the in-apps in the store to get ahead in the game. I've had the impression that the mini-draws after a race were biased against the player, but I didn't have proof until now. I'm tired of the BS this game is forcing on us; I have proof that these mini-draws are not random and the results are not random, instead they are pre-selected so the material you played the race for will not be winnable on certain occasions (if you are trying to get more than one material of your choosing on the 3 races you are allowed per event).

In a real 3-way draw of 3 possible options the chances of obtaining one option on each slot are statistically calculable, I made a save game before entering this race (screenshot 1: chapter 11 - riding dirty (blockade)). I completed the race and was presented with the 3 options for the draw (screenshot 2). My target was to get the fasteners so I can upgrade my BMW M4 for the upcoming ferrari stage. Well, I raced and selected the first slot... and was awarded the input shaft.

Then this is what I did: I downloaded my saved game. I went to the same race and won. the 3 options for the draw were the same, in different order. I selected the first slot... and I got the input shaft again.

So far, that is statistically acceptable. But this is what happened after reloading my saved game and playing 12 TIMES the race: I got the input shaft on the first slot no matter what were the options offered.

Then it got worse. I reloaded my saved game and played 12 TIMES the race again, this time selecting always the SECOND slot... I got the input shaft EVERY TIME.

So, in order to be thorough and be sure to call this game a FRAUD, a reloaded my saved game and played 13 TIMES the race again this time selecting the THIRD slot. No surprises this time, I got the input shaft EVERY TIME AGAIN.

I'm trying to get my money back through support but it seems that nobody in the Firemonkeys team is dedicated to actual customer service. More than my money, what angers me the most is the time I invested in this sore excuse for a sleazy casino-slot game disguised as racing. I trusted the Firemonkeys because I play Real Racing 3 and I have hundreds of hours on that game in spite of their restless attempts to collect money from me. I know better now, and I'm abandoning this game with a hard lesson earned: EA/Firemonkeys are no better than Gameloft when it comes to racing apps.

I don't know if any of you in this forum have the same feeling; I dare you to invest a little of your grinding time to replicate my experiment and confirm/dispute what I had proved on my end. I'm playing on an android phone and the game version is 1.2.6. Please post your results in this thread in case you run your own tests; maybe the facts and our protest will force the developers to come clean and fix this abuse.

[PaladineUK · Accepted solution]

I don't normally necro threads but given we were discussing this issue almost 2 years ago and there are recent developments I figured I would share them.

So today (due to yet more cash grabbing by EA) the Belgian Gaming Commission has stated that RNG boxes in video games are classed as gambling and as such they must abide by gambling laws (I explained the legal position on this a looong time ago - see earlier int his thread).  They are now looking to ban Pay to Win RNG boxes in video games which is likely to become an EU wide ban at some point int he next couple of years.

Furthermore, Politicians in the US are also calling out EA's predatory practices (gambling laws in the US are very strict) so we will probably see some action there as well in the not too distant future.

So back to this thread - because it has now been established that RNG boxes are a form of gambling, they must follow gambling laws which means that the outcome cannot be pre-determined in a game of chance - meaning that the boxes in NFS:No Limits -must- be random in order to be lawful.

I haven't done any further research on the boxes in NFS:No Limits on whether or not EA have changed their behaviour to make the outcome random or not since this thread back in 2016 - but it would be interesting to know.

Today's ruling by the Belgian Gaming Commission is a really good thing because RNG boxes have rapidly become one of the worst aspects of video games and I for one will be very glad to see them gone for good.

[leaderone_gr]

So I'm running the count on chapter 13:close the gap (rush hour). So far, after 9 attempts reloading a saved game, I'm getting $8,500 instead of fasteners EVERY SINGLE TIME. This is insanely insulting.

[GraspGG]

Hello leaderone,

I completely understand your arguments and as i looks like, based on your wide testing, the result of those mini-draws seem to be pre-set.

The results of each individual mini-draw might be pre-set at a certain time (e.g. after playing the very first race, after getting a specific car, etc.). If this mini-draw result pre-setting does happen randomly* or if the results are hardcoded for each individual mini-draw - only the developers can tell.

As far as you don't know the result, it feels randomly selected, doesn't it? The developers might pre-set the results at a certain time as kind of "cheat barrier", discouraging players from reloading the game over and over to get the result they want? (Please don't get me wrong - i won't call you a cheater!!!)

Lets say you go into a casino, play roulette and the result for the next game (lets say number 22, black) is pre-set. If you don't know that number 22, black will be the next result, the chances for you to win are - statistically - the same. Right? Even if it feels some kind of bad if you know that the result has been pre-set, but only as far as not all numbers will be pre-set at a fairly manner (every single number out of the 37 posibillities will win once within 37 articulated game to serve constant winning statistics). By fact, we can't save and reload at a casino until we win

*random = how to get a "real" random number is pure science! You might have a look at different methods on wiki, which might explain why gaming device hardware is not able to generate a 100% real random result.

P.S. The only thing we (players) might test, is, if those individual results are the same for every player on every device by repeating your procedure through someone else. But would that realy help in any way?

[leaderone_gr]

No, you can't assume the devs put an "anti-cheat" provision on the mini draws and just leave it at that. That is not how you research and try to prove things. I'm not "assuming" that the contest is unfair, I'm stating it is unfair based on the fact that I did tests for it and the results are statistically incompatible with a fair draw.

Why would you try to defend the developers without testing this yourself or waiting for them to give an explanation to my post? There are nothing in the TOS for this game allowing the developers to artificially hinder the player's progress by changing the rules mid game. I understand you may like this game and approve to pay this much for the experience/enjoyment it provides to you, but in my case I feel this is a pattern of behavior that is getting worse on newer games and if don't complain about misleading and deceitful tactics to keep players engaged then we may as well don't care about gambling, because you know, seems that is all the gambler's fault.

[PaladineUK]

The problem here is if people are paying real money (which many of us are) and the mini-games are represented as random but are pre-set then it is a criminal offense under gambling laws all over the civilised world.  Even video games which have gambling in them (games of chance) are covered by gambling laws, so if EA/Firemonkey are actually doing this they could arguably be committing a crime.

Games of chance are supposed to be games of chance and are not permitted under law to be anything but "random".

So the OP could actually be on to a big issue here and I would recommend he talks to a lawyer or his local regulator responsible for gambling regulations.  Potentially he could write to the FTC and file an official complaint as well - under FTC rules it is illegal to misrepresent something to your customers with fines that can run into 10s of millions of dollars.

[the4thviewer]

Have some XP for the effort but you're only adding to what most of us suspect or even 'knew'

This is a 'Free to Play' game but everyone knows that just means 'Fee to Win',  I've done pretty well so far without paying but I've put a lot of effort into my spreadsheet in help plan what I'm doing, the "random" wins just add to the grind.  I just budget it into my fuel, check back every 90 mins and use up the new tanks full.  Its a PITA but its satisfying knowing I've done it without paying.

[PaladineUK]

You are right it is free to play and anyone who hasn't spent money would be unlikely to have any legal route to pursue - but the second they take money off someone those "games of chance" must be "games of chance" and the player must have a real chance to win each of the parts - if it is fixed then they do not have a real chance and EA are therefore in breach of gambling laws, potentially in breach of Fraud laws (obtaining money by deception) and absolutely in breach of various statutes in different countries with regards to misleading consumers.

I work in this area so I am at something of an advantage when it comes to understanding the law and I am pretty damn sure they wouldn't have a leg to stand on if a person who has made In App Purchases files a legal complaint against them.  I know one of the commissioners at the FTC so I will email her and see if she can give me her opinion of the situation.

[PaladineUK]

OK so this is the email I just sent to my contact at the FTC - she is a Commissioner so is in the perfect position to offer a really solid legal opinion on this.

I have been reading some research regarding “Games of Chance” in mobile games which have In App Purchases tied to them and I was hoping you might be able to provide some perspective from the FTC.

The game in question is a car racing game and it is free to download those who do not spend real money on “In App Purchases” (in this case Gold Bars) are restricted to how many races they can play by a number of tickets which refresh over a period of time.  Gold bars can be used to refresh those tickets much faster and the more “In App Purchases” you make the higher your VIP status becomes which gives you more race tickets than lower level VIP users & non-VIP users (you can only become a VIP by making “In App Purchases”).

Now at the end of each race there is a mini-game which is represented as a game of chance – there are three rewards which are flipped over (like cards) and their position is randomised so when you pick a card you win one of the rewards – rewards vary from in game cash (not Gold Bars), various modules to upgrade your cars and visual style points for changing the cosmetic appearance of your car.

These mini-games are represented as games of chance and users are led to believe that the cards are mixed into a random order and that they have a chance of winning any of the three rewards.  However, research has shown that the rewards are in fact fixed and that no matter which card you select you will always win the same reward for the same race.  The research which proves this saved the game directly before a race and then completed the race before selecting a card in the mini game, made a note of the prize then reloaded the saved game to do the same race again.  Every single time the game was reloaded, the researcher received the same reward every single time irrespective of the card they chose.  This research was repeated for multiple races to ensure that it was not a bug and indeed the same behaviour was found for every single race tested – races were tested in excess of 20 times per race using the same save game file before starting each instance of the race.

It seems to me that there could be several legal issues with this situation.

First and foremost, many consumers purchase gold bars for real money so they can complete more races and improve their cars faster so they can gain higher results in competitions.  The developer of the game is intentionally misleading those paying customers by making them believe the mini games (which are a very important part of the game, they are the main way you upgrade your cars) are games of chance when in fact they have a predetermined outcome and the player does not have a chance of winning any of the three displayed rewards, only the reward which has been pre-determined.  So it is my opinion the developer would be in breach of FTC rules because they are misleading consumers.

Secondly, as far as I am aware (and this is certainly the case in Europe) games of chance must actually be games of chance – that being they must provide the player the opportunity of winning any of the described rewards/prizes.  It is a fundamental and underlying principle of gambling regulations.  So it is my belief that the developer may also be in breach of gambling regulations as well.

Finally, it is my belief that if the developer leads the player to believe that they have a real chance of winning something they actually have no chance of winning and the developer is making revenues from this (In App Purchases) they are potentially guilty of fraud because they are obtaining moneys by deception.

I would really value you thoughts on this issue and if they echo my concerns I will be filing an official complaint with the full details to your office.

[the4thviewer]

There must be someone who can route around the code and see how the "chance" works?

[PaladineUK]

There is no chance, the OP has clearly shown through dozens of tests that the outcome is -always- the same irrespective of which card you pick - that is where the problem lies, there is no chance it is pre-determined and it is my belief that is illegal under multiple different areas of law as highlighted in my email to my contact at the FTC.

I am in Brussels next week for meetings at the EU Parliament, so I will talk to a few contacts there as well in the EU Commission and see what they think about this under EU law.