Next Game Idea: Consumables

by Iron_Guard8
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Next Game Idea: Consumables

★★★★★ Expert

One thing the new game needs to do well on is how it handles consumables. I actually don’t mind the timer system in BfN as compared to the constant spam of outhouse zombies we get in GW and GW2, but I also feel the choices are far too limited and this is also an issue with the more individualistic AI mobs that we used to have in GW and GW2 and in the other games too. This extends to team retries and self-revives since I have so many of both in GW2 especially, that they feel wasted when I get them in packs., but they need to be a thing as I want Ops to return to the GW and GW2 style of Ops as opposed to BfN’s.

 

Rux will be the main source of consumable items. This is a key change from before. No longer will you buy packs and get a mix of costume pieces, character stickers, and so on. Instead, most things will be sold by Rux for various amounts of coins. Some will have to be unlocked via various methods (free roam zones, battle passes, purchased for coins, etc.), but some will be generally available, while some are opened up and made generally available if you play a higher tier; free tier gives you basic consumable access (team retries, self-revives, browncoat zombies, weeds, heal weeds, heal zombies, conehead zombies, pumpkinhead weeds, imps (the explodey kind), dandelions, bonk choy pots, heal flower pots, gatling peashooter pots, peashooter pots, DR. heals bot, boxer bot, gatling bot, and rocket bot), the basic paid tier adds; buckethead zombies, terracotta weeds, flag zombies, flag weeds, lightning reed pots, Scaredy Shrooms, Hide and Shoot Bots, and mister electro bots; and the deluxe tier adds; leaf shield weeds, screen door zombies, hypno-shrooms, karate zombies, mister toasty bots, snapdragon pots, doom shroom pots, and MR. explodey bots. Note that if you upgrade your account level later you will gain all these immediately. If you already unlocked them via spending coins, you will be awarded coins in the same amount that you spent to unlock them.

 

Rux’s store will be available in the bases in your personal neighborhood and the public battlefield, in between PvP matches and likely between Ops, and in the free roam zone bases.

 

Once you have unlocked a consumable, however it is done, you can always visit Rux and spend coins to increase how many you have. When you first unlock one, you won’t have any to use immediately, but instead will be able to visit Rux and spend coins to buy uses of any unlocked consumable; this replaces getting them out of packs. The cost will be variable, based on how powerful that consumable is; for example a basic browncoat zombie might be 500 coins, while a coffin zombie would be 5000 for comparison. So, if you had 10 thousand coins to spend, you could buy 2 coffin zombies, or 20 browncoats for that same price in this example. These are used up when you summon them just like in GW and GW2, so if you had 10 weeds bought and used all 10, you’d not be able to summon any more of them until you bought more at Rux.

 

The idea here is that you have a large amount of control over which consumables you have, and how many of each consumable you own. While most will require unlocking, even as a deluxe version player, this unlocking can be done via spending coins, working on the battle pass/prize map, and questing/exploring in the free roam zones. My idea is to have more consumables than any of the previous 3 games, and to keep expanding them, the fact that this may be overwhelming in variety for selecting them in game will be covered in a later portion of this post.

 

As far as function, there will be some overlap, like the pirate map zombie and the newspaper zombie are functional identical, but that small difference adds flavor, and PvZ is about small changes as well as big ones. Many of the more unusual variants of consumable plants and zombies will be unlocked via the free roam zones as part of that zone’s theme; for example, you’d unlock the pirate zombies in a nautical themed free roam zone, and if you want primordial heal flowers, you’d have to hop over to the prehistoric free roam zone. This does mean that you won’t need to unlock all of them, but can focus on just the ones you want. That being said, unlocking them won’t be super expensive, although the more powerful ones will cost more to unlock, just like they cost more to buy copies of them. This allows player with time and coins to focus on a few, while completionists like me, can work on getting them all!

 

Menu selection with so many options: In GW1 especially, there are a lot of options for zombies and pots to summon. It works fine, but I want to add in all the ones we have in all 3 shooters already, and many more besides. This would be a mess to deal with, so you would have favorites set for the following; potted plants, zombie bots, plant mobile AI, and zombie mobile AI. These would be listed at the beginning of your option list when interacting with the appropriate summon point, and the rest afterward so they’re still there, but your preferred consumables are at the front of the list making it easier to pick in a hurry. You can set these favorites at pretty much anytime you aren’t in an active multiplayer game.

 

Why I think this is a good system: Essentially it gives the players a lot of choice in what they get, it reduces spam of only the most powerful consumables, allows you to focus on the ones you like the most, gives you some control on the UI for summoning them, and means you won’t end up with thousands of self-revives but you can still buy as many as you feel you need. It avoids the randomness of buying packs by letting us decide when to spend our coins and where to focus our questing efforts so we unlock the consumables we want the most.

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Re: Next Game Idea: Consumables

Community Manager

Thanks for taking the time to share your feedback with the community @Iron_Guard8.

 

Darko

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Re: Next Game Idea: Consumables

[ Edited ]
★★★★★ Expert

@Iron_Guard8I think they should also improve the viability of the non heavy armored zombies such as flag zombie and while he was useful and gave buffs to players maybe they could give him a passive leader ability where other ai would follow him in a group and be immune to things like chili bean bomb that way he is more of an prolonged threat on the battlefield that rewards players who are putting down spawnables and a bigger movement and damage speed upgrade to newspaper zombie when he loses it like the pvz 2 newspaper zombie. We need more anti class spawnables like karate and dancing zombies, maybe the zombot soldier who will specifically try and neutralize players on rooftops rather than focus on pots. Allowing regular zombies to ease back from the ranged attacks they were spamming in bfn.

One thing I disliked about Bfn's system was that the timer was too dang long and you most likely finish the match before you could use some of them again and the lack of spawnables was reduced to only armored variations like bucketheads.

The plants need more unique spawnables that mess with players like the zombies backup dancers and such as all they really have is hypnoshroom.

I like the idea of being able to specifically buy certain zombies as it keeps coins relevant after bfn's disastrous economy.

 

The pirates in gw1 were reskins but they still added to themes of maps they appeared for ops and maybe a coded system in place that spawns them into era appropriate atire like mummy wraps in Zygpt and such

Revives are sadly necessary as bfn ops is painfully easy and death is meaningless as long as 1 guy survives and while boss hunt has a similar system in boss hunt the objective is hunting you and the ai is on steroids while you are trying to complete various objectives where being just one corn down can doom you to a team wipe (sasquatch hungers and yeti's winter).

I feel like some of the defensive ai needs to be buffed imo bonk choy should be more lime gw1 to punish unthinking players and he can dismantle outhouse and coffin zombie with his bare hands. Fire pots and bots could also use more viability, maybe give toxic ai a damage radius like toxic variants would?

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Re: Next Game Idea: Consumables

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@stukapookaI'm 100% behind giving the AI extra abilities to make them more effective, especially the melee pots/bots like Bonk Choy and the Boxer Bot as they are so limited, which is also why I had them as starting options for any tier of player as many people may not want to spend extra coins to unlock them!

 

With Wildflowers and TV Heads gone, the dynamic will be less focused on ranged AI too so that will make the melee only AI of all types more useful as well. Barring removing those obnoxious AI from BfN, I want all the old AI of all types back in the game and to add more as well; like the dog walking zombie from Heroes, the Chicken Wrangler Zombie, the Celery Stalker, and so on (although some of these may be made into playable characters).

 

Even today, I still use some self-revives and more rarely team retries in GW1 and GW2, so with making Ops more interesting and challenging (also with all the old difficulty levels from easy to Crrraazzzyy) we can still use them and can buy as many as we think we need, without having thousands of the things.

 

I want so many options and reasons to spend coins so they always feel good to get that I want them to have a vast plethora of options, even if the only difference between some is basically a skin and some vocal options; the pirate zombies in GW1 you summoned would say stuff like 'arg, brainz!' and while small, it's one of those little details that I love to see.

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Re: Next Game Idea: Consumables

[ Edited ]
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@Iron_Guard8I hope they do tone down the ranged attacks from heavily armored zombies where in gw1 it felt like an easter egg to get attacked by their ray gun bit in bfn they're constantly spamming it to kill you.

They have so many games to pull zombies and plants from it should honestly be easy to find some to use, heck gw1 had scrapped bungee zombies and balloon zombie was once a concept alongside spider robots and it wpuld be interesting to see them used, maybe have the bungees be a special wave where they drop right ontop of plauers and pots positions before disconnecting and attacking.

Self revives were best utilized on crazy amd boss hunt where surviving until the wave ends is not a good strategy for one person and I really wish we got official boss hunts in bfn as those pathetic elites dont even scratch the difficulty itch that spooky squash or sasquatch were as those hunts really utilized the ai well like the blitzers during the garden phase of sasquatch.

There are so many details from gw1 and 2 that aren't in bfn like the idle animations like corn checking his cobs, superbrainz getting into a fighting stance or clenching his fist, the backup dancers "aw yeah" as they attack plants, the gardens musical theme and zombies themes and chants when taking it over "grow, grow, grow", character voices from the plants taunt commands, and the tallnut barriers grunts. There small things but you really miss them when they're gone and bfn is definitely emptier without them.

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Re: Next Game Idea: Consumables

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@EA_Darko Presuming you are on the PvZ dev team or are in someway related to PopCap, what do you think the chances are for PopCap to expand further beyond mobile games (like in their current state?)
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Re: Next Game Idea: Consumables

Community Manager

Hey @LegoMinecraft0 I do not have any info that I can share with you in relation to the future of PVZ.

Personally, I would love to see the series continue and would love a next-gen sequel to Neighborville.

 

Darko 

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Re: Next Game Idea: Consumables

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@EA_Darko Thanks for participating in the conversation! Most of the time when a game loses support and/or sunsets, I move on like most people do. The PvZ shooters are a special case in which I want to see more and miss getting new content and characters in the 3 games. I tend to brainstorm on the side a lot so turned that to some ideas here in an effort to inspire PopCap to make the next shooter the best ever, to show that there are several of us that are still around, and to see what others think. The Reddit is more active than the forums, but lately it's mostly just memes and videos.

I really want to see the series continue as well. I'm more of the mind to return to the GW formula with some of the features of BfN (the more visible HUD indicators, the free roam zones, multiple slots for character builds), but if they can make an improved BfN (more characters, damage attenuation (drop off), better Ops, and other needed improvements like sorely needed character changes), I'll certainly give it a look. Whatever they do for a new game, it needs to handle hackers well, have crossplay for all platforms, and long term support so we can enjoy it for a long time and have a lot of things to do in game. 

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Re: Next Game Idea: Consumables

Community Manager

Hey @Iron_Guard8 I will pass your feedback on to the team.


Darko 

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Re: Next Game Idea: Consumables

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@EA_Darko Thanks! I hope it helps. I'm not arrogant enough to think that I have all the best ideas, or only my ideas will work, but I do like to think about things I care about and try to share the ideas when I've done some work on them. I hope that at the very least it can spark other ideas for folks to use or at least ponder.

 

I still play all three games to this day, GW1 the least as there's less opportunity to play solo well there, but I have over 300 hours in GW1, 800 in BfN, and 2700 in GW2. I'm almost level capped in BfN, and have been capped on the other 2 for a long time. These are also the only games where I actually went after all the achievements. I'm a bit older now as a Gen Xer, so not the typical PvZ shooter player but have been keeping my eyes out for a new game in the series and plan to continue doing so. I hope that day comes soon, but not too soon, so the game has a more successful and pleasant launch.

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