Racial slur in werewolves pack [ Edited ]

[xochiquetzl_xkvn]

I wasn't addressing any specific press releases, I was attempting to explain how tropes work. I'm not a game designer, but I am a published author (with a day job lol) and there's a similar skill set involved.

For example, vampires. Let's think about how they would implement a vampires pack/how I would write a vampire book. For people to recognize it as vampires, they need to drink blood (or plasma), sleep in coffins, not age, etc. These are tropes and are culturally derived, usually from literature or mass media. In the case of vampires, they gave us mutliple tropes to play with, including the Nosferatu style vampire (Vlad) and the charming vampire (for all your Edward Cullen/Louis de Pointe du Lac needs). Most vampire tropes in the US and UK come from Bram Stoker, who got a lot of them from the Victorian serial Varny the Vampire. Dracula wasn't the first vampire novel in English, just the one that's the most famous today.

For example, farming. Why set a farming pack in the UK? To manage expectations about whether the pack is about having as many cows or llamas as possible (US Midwest/West style), perhaps herded by cowboys on horseback, or whether it's a cozier "All Creatures Great and Small" experience.

For example: werewolves. If you look at the history of werewolf media, the most popular recent examples are Remus Lupin in the Harry Potter books (see The Moonwood Collective) and Twilight. In order to recognize them as werewolves, we need the full moon, turning into a wolf, losing touch with your humanity, etc. Because the Harry Potter books have no vampire/werewolf war and Twilight does, well. (What We Do in the Shadows also has a vampire/werewolf conflict, but it's a parody.) Googling also produces Underworld, but the most famous example is Twilight. There is no Vampire/Werewolf conflict in The Wolf Man, An American Werewolf in London, etc., but Twilight is wildly popular and apparently the trope was considered popular and important enough to include it. Why set a werewolf pack in a logging town in what looks like the Pacific Northwest instead of an English boarding school or London? It's a shorthand to help set your expectations.

This is how tropes work.

However, tropes are sometimes culturally loaded with undesirable baggage, and sometimes this undesirable baggage will spill over. Not using the undesirable baggage is hard work, and sometimes well-intentioned creators screw up, just because of the way tropes work. 

As you were.

[jpkarlsen]

@xochiquetzl_xkvn 

So it was all conjecture on your part. Good to know.

Since I was not familiar with Twilight I looked it up and discovered some interesting facts.

1. There are no werewolves in the films only shapeshifters who have a totally different backstory than werewolves. Unlike werewolves their powers are inherited and they are all from an native indian tribe Shape-shifters of the Quileute tribe are also called Quileute wolves. This is is probably why you thought that werewolves where indigenous indians.

2. There are werewolves  in the books but they were omitted in the films. Probably because they did not play a big part in the main story line. The books mention that unlike shapeshifters a werewolf could singlehandedly kill a Vampire.

3. Looking at YouTube I can see that the shapeshifters bears no resemblance to the Werewolves in The Sims 4. Unlike werewolves the shapeshifters can switch to their wolf form at any time during the day not just at night and the looks are totally different.

You fixated on that the scenery from the film resembled the scenery in the films but it could in fact have been  any small logging town all over the world. The book places it in Forks Washington state. 

The werewolf myth comes from ancient Greece where a man called Lycan angered Zeus so he turned him into a wolf. Major belief in the myth came in the middle ages in central Europe where there were werewolf trials in an area that is now Switzerland. Interestingly a lot of places there looks like the scenery in Moonwood Mills.

If you ever want to write a book on Werewolves I hope you are a bit more educated on the subject

[Bluebellflora]

I'm really confused by what the actual offence seems to be with this new pack. Is it werewolves or is it using the word savage/savagely?

Seems like a bit of a reach to be offended by either in this pack given that werewolves, as jpkarlsen has pointed out, originated in Ancient Greek mythology and the word savage has been around for centuries and for the large majority of people has no link to a specific indigenous culture anywhere in the world.

Maybe the problem is using pop culture as reference and evidence instead of the original source and meanings of both? Bit like using a tabloid newspaper as proof of science rather than the peer reviewed papers published in respected journals...

[JSmithh013]

@jpkarlsen 

That being said there is a dormant ability called transformation mastery that allows you to transform at will, making it more like twilight.

This a USA company so the words that have been used to harm Indigenous peoples on this continent matters. On this continent because of it’s historical use since settlers arrived some Indigenous people view the “s” word as our equivalent to the “n” word. Which is why I don’t think it’s appropriate to use.

[jpkarlsen]

It is correct that the books (and the films?) mentions that the shapeshifting ability is dormant until they meet a vampire.

Don't know what that has to do with werewolves.

[CovenantNine]

The word savage isn’t a racist word. It can be used in a bad way but it’s not the same as some other purely racist words. If it were only used as a racial slur towards indigenous people in a negative manner it would be considered a racial slur. However the word itself means “

1.

(of an animal or force of nature) fierce, violent, and uncontrolled.

2.

(of something bad or negative) very great; severe.

"the decision was a savage blow for the town"

3.

a brutal or vicious person.

"the mother of one of the victims has described his assailants as savages"

verb

1. (especially of a dog or wild animal) attack ferociously and maul.

   "ewes savaged by marauding dogs"

savageadjective

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sav·​age | \ ˈsa-vij \

Definition of savage

 (Entry 1 of 3)

1a: not domesticated or under human control : UNTAMEDsavage beasts

b: lacking the restraints normal to civilized human beings : FIERCE, FEROCIOUSa savage criminal

2: WILD, UNCULTIVATEDseldom have I seen such savagescenery— Douglas Carruthers

3a: BOORISH, RUDEthe savage bad manners of most motorists— M. P. O'Connor

b: MALICIOUS

4old-fashioned + offensive : lacking complex or advanced culture : UNCIVILIZED

savage

noun

plural savages

Definition of savage (Entry 2 of 3)

1old-fashioned + offensive : a person belonging to a primitive society

2: a brutal person

3: a rude or unmannerly person

savage

verb

savaged; savaging

Definition of savage (Entry 3 of 3)

transitive verb

: to attack or treat brutally

Now when you look up actual racial

slurs these are the definitions you get. I am not going to post the words themselves but only the definitions as long as they don’t include the foul language. 

so actual racial slurs look like this 

noun

OFFENSIVE

1. a contemptuous term for a black or dark-skinned person.

XXXXX is an English-language ethnic slur usually referring to a person of Chinese descent. The word is also sometimes indiscriminately used against people of East Asian and Southeast Asian appearance

XXXX (also spelled XXXXX) is an ethnic slur used in the United States for people from Spanish-speaking (especially those in Latin America) and Italian-speaking countries.

so as you can see if it actually were a racial slur the definition would look a lot different and explain it’s an offensive racial slur. 

[JSmithh013]

Adjective, adverb, noun it doesn’t matter all forms of the word have been and continues to be used to harm Indigenous peoples of the Americas. In my personal experience I’ve had all forms of the word used against me negatively since at least 5 years old. 

This company resides on stolen land of the Tolowa, Yurok, Chilula, Wiyot, Karok, sinkyone and Muwekma Ohlone to name a few. So the words uses on the continent the company resides on is relevant. 

[xochiquetzl_xkvn]

@CovenantNine 

As others have pointed out, words mean different things in different places. There is a four letter word that means molten metal or glass that also means “woman of loose morals” in the UK and I would not tell a UK simmer she was not allowed to be offended if in a new Iron Man pack the first level of the skill tree was slag and there was flavor text of “Congratulations! You’re a Slag!” 🤣

There’s also a word that means Pakistani immigrant in the UK that is pronounced exactly the same way as the affectionate nickname for liquor stores in Boston (“package stores,” “packy” for short). If the Sims team were to roll out a convenience store pack and set it in Boston, they might be able to get away with naming liquor stores “packies,” but I would expect UK Simmers of Pakistani descent to not love it (and they shouldn’t). If they set the pack in London and spelled it without a C, those same Simmers would be angry to be told that some items of a nefarious nature could only be purchased from a [British ethic slur]. 

Context matters.

[Bluebellflora]

@xochiquetzl_xkvn

That analogy makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. Slag is not molten metal or glass, it is a wasteful by-product of smelting metals. Hence your example should actually read “Congratulations! You’re slag!” which also makes no sense because how would it be levelling up when it is actually a waste product to be discarded? It would be levelling down. And why have you capitalised the ‘S’? If I said “look at that giant slag heap” it doesn’t require the ‘S’ to be capitalised.

[taffster74]

I'm going to try and tread carefully here. First of all, to say that a word like savage is a blanket racist slur is incorrect when a person is not viewing the word in context. If everyone took something like this to heart, then there would virtually be no sims game as there'd be people from all cultures accusing the sims team of cultural slurs, cultural appropriation, etc, et al. Secondly, to claim that the "savage" when used as an adjective to refer to a person of indigenous origin is exclusive to American-Indians is being racially insensitive to other peoples who have also had that term applied to them. I refer to Indigenous South and Central Americans, Australian Aboriginals, Indigenous Fijians, pacific islanders. I can even go back in history and point out that the Normans used the term when referring to the Welsh. Coincidently, so did the Romans. Heck, even the English continued to use the term when referring to both the Welsh and the Scottish up until 200 years ago. Yet, no-one of Welsh, Scottish, Aboriginal, Fijian, South/Central American, Pacific Islander descent is complaining and through the term racist around. Look, I a do understand and appreciate that people do cop racial slurs from ignoramus' in this world (and believe you me, there are some real ignoramus' around), but this? Taking a word and saying it is a blanket racial slur (blanket meaning any and all contextual usage of the word) is a bit too much. And, it can also be seen as reverse racism. Just because a handful of ignorant douche-bags have their heads stuck in the backwoods, doesn't mean that all people of anglo-European descent are racist when they use the word. Yet - now correct me if I am wrong - it seem that what is the OP is (in a not so veiled manner) trying to say. 

Look, I'm down in Australia and my ancestors are anything but Anglo-Saxon - try Welsh, Irish, Scottish and Sicilian-Italian (good recipe for a temper. lol). All of them were free settlers and do not originate with the first fleet (1788). Okay, yes, Anglo-Saxons did treat the Aboriginals appallingly - I'm not arguing that - but it was not my ancestors, nor was it me. So why should i have to apologise for something someone else did over 200 years ago? The same goes for this situation. The developers/programmers at EA have used the word savage in a manner that is purely descriptive of an action, not a person or a race. 

Another example, and i feel this is more to the point here. All through infants and primary school (Elementary, early middle school for our US friends) I was picked on by bully's for a number of reasons. Due in part to my temper (see above) and my own personality, I always stood up for myself. Yes, some of those things i was picked on for have followed me through my life - namely a stammer. Now, i could let that affect my social interactions and simply isolate myself from the world. I could be over-sensitive. But i don't. Because being over-sensitive only leads an individual down a vicious spiral - it goes around and around until eventually everything is seen as a slight. And i think that is what happening here. Anglo-European Americans could take offense at being called "White Skins" by certain groups, but do they? 

My point is this. To the OP, if you take offense at certain individuals slinging racial slurs at you, fair enough. That is your right to do so. Just as it is your right - within the bounds of state and federal laws - to stand up to it. Your problem is with them. Not the entire Anglo-European population.