Feedback: The Sims 4 is Lacking Details in Gameplay

[SqueamishNerd]

@AprilTheSimmer96 I totally missed your first post (#6)!

If TS4 Outdoor Retreat is installed the sims can roast marshmallows over campfires. They can also roast hot dogs, veggie dogs, beetles (Eco Lifestyle) and fish. They can't do it at fireplaces though.

Sims can tuck in toddlers and children in TS4 too. I'm not completely sure if it came with TS4 Parenthood or if it's base game. The interaction can both be directed and is made autonomously. I think the toddler/child can ask an adult to do it, which makes the adult follow the toddler/child to the bed to tuck them in. They can also read toddlers to sleep (I don't think that they can read children to sleep, and if they can't I wish they could).

[AprilTheSimmer96]

@SqueamishNerd You're right about it being basegame. ☺️ I wonder if it came with the Parenthood patch or something. 😯 Also yes, the toddler can ask an adult to tuck them in as well. 😉

Also sadly no, they can't read children to sleep (as far as I know). Maybe 'cause they're older than toddlers? 😯 Idk. But it would be cool. ☺️

[PugLove888]

@SqueamishNerd , I did a little testing on Goofball Sims and Childish Sims and this is what I found so far:
Childish Sims could:
play with doll house
play with small toys
play, hug, and talk to large stuffed animals
play in the bathtub
They cannot use the Voidcritter battle station or packs, the monkey bars, the puppet theater, use the kid's doctor kit (for empathy),  or the kid's chemistry table

Goofball Sims could not do any of these activities, even the ones that Childish Sims can do! 

There might be more things that Childish Sims can do, but these were what I could think of at the moment! 

Update: Childish Sims can play with small toys, but you have to take them out of the toybox first , as you can't direct them to do so from the toybox itself.

[CircuitD]

I agree TS2 was my favorite as well. I wished they just recreate it with improved graphics. I liked TS3 a lot but that is because I had a ton of mods on it, like Story Progression, cc and I loved the open neighborhoods. At first when I got tS4 I was disappointed that we have load screens again, but because they are fairly short and at least the surroundings in each world are quite open I don’t mind so much.  But here also. I like being able to catch bugs and gather stuff. These neighborhoods like sims are much prettier but lifeless. The moodlets would not be as bad in TS4 if they would better tie personality and if there were more of them. They are moody loonatics no matter what is their trait. Some of the moods don’t fit the situation or sim. It is frustrating that the EA team hasn’t added anything in this area or improved on it in 6 years. This was their biggest selling point. Where is scared? I don’t need flirty and very flirty. That is just the same thing. And maybe the sims should have a different mood around a new flirt and around a lifelong partner or kids (different based on relationships and traits).  I don’t know: loved? Maybe if they struggle with something they could get frustrated? If they do yoga they could feel zen, not just inspired. Also, tense is not scared and the sim looks just angry. I have a bookworm sim that doesn’t want to read. Seriously, every time I tell him to, he does it for a few minutes and puts the book away. He’s a bookworm? The difference are so small they are imperceptible. In previous games if two sims that didn’t like each other ran into each other you’d know that they don’t like each other by their reaction. Now my sim enemies and having a drink and a chat just like any other sim. Where is the flaming poop after a break up? They just get maybe a bit angry and become friends. Sometimes go straight to friends. Shouldn’t their personality traits have an impact here? How is my evil or mean sim ok with that? Where is the child crying because they caught the parent cheating. I had a child walk in on who hoo and there was no reaction. I was hoping they will tell the other parent or at least prompt a interaction that would let them do it. But nope. Just like I can’t do anything when I caught klepto steeling,( the klepto gets embarrassed but the other sim has no power in this encounter) I can’t skip on the bill etc.  The get two allotted days of sadness when someone from family dies even if they hate the person. It’s like a here is your sad badge. After those days it doesn’t matter. There is no lifelong consequences. My sim killed 6 husbands no one is even raising an eyebrow. I thought maybe she gets a black widow trait. I got a useless achievement that does absolutely nothing. No gossip, not even a bad reputation. Limit the phone call for job change add add other more meaningful phone calls. Ask on date? Gossips? Reputation that is a bag of crap. Don’t get me started on those. They are so shallow. They are either good or bad. How limited is that? And then there is no attraction or preference system so everyone just likes the same things. You can gift any sim money or book and they will react the same no matter the sim, their traits, their relationship etc. Happy happy happy... overwrites everything. New clothes? You can have them go in a bathing suit to a restaurant and they won’t even be embarrassed. That actually happened in sims 3 or 2. They dance the same, learn the same, react the same. Nothing has impact or it is so small you don’t even notice. And then there is the interaction options themselves. You can ‘praise vampire lifestyle’ 15 times in a row to any sim and it will always be the same. Flirt always works and pickup line never does. I can predict the outcome of every interaction. No surprises or guess work. No risk taking. The Interaction choices barely change. I can’t have one sims introduce another or family member. I can’t ask for hand and it will probably just be successful. And the interactions we are given have 90% predictable outcomes and once again no impact on traits. Here is what I would like to see:

- add more options of interactions based on relationships other then friends. There are family members, enemy, coworkers (you have only few and as always it’s just friendly). They should put some effort into developing the nuances. 
- add a few more emotions because some just don’t fit. I can’t believe there is no scared. 
- to make this even more interesting I would limit certain emotions to traits. Like a excitable sim should be the only sim to get an exited emotion or exhilarated. Evil should be the only to get something like manic happy. Family oriented should be the only sim to get content around family. Athletic pumped ( not just energized which everyone gets) etc etc. I get they do with the description, but it just reflexes as happy or tense. That is the basic point. The color just makes this limited. My athletic, hot headed sim with a maxed athletic skill should not be losing fights with his non-athletic neighbor. That actually happened. And it made me realize that skill has little impact as well. To a degree it does but like I said some situations just make no sense. EA should fix it.  
- add an attraction and preference system. I don’t want my sim to like the same things. All sim games had preferences like color, drink (which supposedly they have I just can’t remember what it is so I have one interaction that just overwrites this) food etc. that should translate to friendships (like shared traits or opposite traits). Attraction system  doesn’t have to be complicated just exist to make certain sims stand out or be rejected. Sims 2 had a pretty decent system. And don’t want the sim to like someone because they are a snob especially if your sims doesn’t know it yet. Give me 3 likes and one dislike that would prompt different interactions and impact long term actions. 

- updates to reputation. Give me more then good or bad. If a sim is prolific at something they do, like multiple spouses, career, interactions etc they should get a reputation that reflects that. With it they should get new interactions from not only the sim with the reputation but others as well (With TS4 it’s very one sided). Something similar exists for celebrities. They get quirks. I am not saying every sim should have a reputation quirk but those that are prolific (have repeated actions or prolonged actions) at something should and it should have a global impact. Even earning reputations should depend on what it is. Some should be easier noticeable others maybe have not only certain actions repeated but other criteria like skill. Turn those achievements into something that impacts gameplay. If my sim is a mob boss with a mean streak maybe other sim should recognize that in a small way. I’m not talking about fainting like with celebrities but something. Also another evil sim should have a different outlook at these reputations. A sim that volunteers a lot should maybe get a reputation for being a simanitarian. There are so many things that can be done. Pillar of community, life saver, thief. If one sim keeps borrowing money and not returning it maybe they should get a reputation for being a mooch (since this is no longer a trait) and have sim ask him for their money back or get fined or even go to jail. The sim in turn might get new interactions on how to ask for money like pretend grandma is sick to trick other sim to keep giving them money. Now you can ask for loan and not returning it has no impact (as everything else in this game) so instead of quirks maybe they do it as a learned trait or habit.  Do something to make sim stand out and I hate how everything in TS4 is sooooo easy. Make things more challenging.

- add traits and aspirations. Currently this is the only thing we have or can do so give players more options. I want schmoozer back. And if I live in a perfect world have my schmoozer make quick friends but struggle making long term friends. Have them move up their career easier when schmoozing and being friends with boss but struggle getting to the top (since there is no one to suck up to) maybe schmoozer only have the potential to get a brown-noser or manipulator reputation but only if they achieve the max of charisma while working in certain jobs and completing a challenge. This doesn’t have to be present for all traits, some can share interactions or challenges but it should have a global impact.

I know this might seem like a lot. But, think about it this way. It’s a lot because none of those things exist in TS4 and some were existent in previous versions . It goes to show how limited and shallow this game is. How little they done to improve it, update it or change it. Oh it’s pretty. I love build ( but there aren’t enough lots to build on), but game play is oversimplified, moods overwrite everything, and It has no life. There is no nuances, it’s calculated, it’s not engaging, my sims are now clones. There is nothing that distinguishes them from each other, nothing that impacts long term play. It’s so this and done. There are modders that have already introduced some of these things so it can be done. I just don’t want mods because I have to update with each EA update. I played TS2 and 3 for hours. This gets me border after 30 min. Because my sim are lifeless clones. 

ps: I want the havoc can wielding elders back and flaming poop. 

[CircuitD]

@CircuitD Oh and they didn’t even bother to fix the vampires circadian cycle. If you call a vamp at night they get mad like the rest of the sim. Apparently they are sleeping?

[SqueamishNerd]

@PugLove888 Any sim seem to be able to buy Voidcritter packs on the computer, and open them, so they can collect Voidcritter cards, but they can't swap the cards with other sims. I feel like adult sims should be able to play with the Voidcritter station too. I mean, Voidcritters are basically like Pokémon, and in real life a lot of adults play Pokémon games or watch the Pokémon anime, often together with their children. At least childish and geek sims should be able to play with the Voidcritter station, but I would rather see any sims being able to do it. It would be a nice thing children and adults could do together, because now there's almost nothing that children and adults can do together. Children and adults can build the school projects (from Parenthood) together, adults sims can read to children, other than that?... Well, they can at least talk with each other. xD I guess childish adults can play with the doll house together with children too, is that right?

So odd that adult sims can't take out toys from the toy boxes by themselves, that we must open the box to take them out for them. That also means that adults can't take out toys from the toy box to give to a toddler or child.

@CircuitD "Some of the moods don’t fit the situation or sim." reminds me of something that happened in my game yesterday. I have a klepto sim, she autonomously stole a vase at the museum. I didn't want the vase, I would rather have it in that museum, and she's far from short on money, so I put the vase in her home and clicked "Return stolen object". She got a happy moodlet saying something like "It feels so good to give back things I've stolen." and I was like "Wait, what? You're a kleptomaniac..." I have no idea what it's like to feel the urge to steal stuff in real life, I have no idea if people who do it feel good for giving the stuff back, but this is The Sims, and I feel like my klepto sim, who's also evil and mean/grouchy (not sure what the trait is called in English), shouldn't be happy about giving stolen stuff back. Right?

I agree that there are too few moods. I think scared should absolutely be added. Also, the tense mood often feels like it should be stressed instead, and sometimes it's referred to as "stressed", at least in the Swedish translation of the game, for example with Parenthood when sims can ask another sim about their mood it says "Talk about stressed mood" when the sim they're talking to is tense. Yoga should give a calm mood and a zen moodlet, imo.

This thing with enemies not looking like enemies, it's so annoying. They always look so happy when they greet each other. But when an enemy dies I think they get happy, and they get happy from viewing their enemy's grave/urn. Maybe they have to be arch-enemies for that though? I'm not completely sure. Evil sims will point and laugh during another sims death in an accident, for example a fire, but they'll get sad after the sim has died, even if they didn't knew the sim.

Talking about skills not being beneficial. In TS3 sims could run faster if they had higher athletic skill. In TS4 everyone runs at the same speed.

Attractions and preference system: Yes please!

Didn't they fix the vampiric circadian rhythm? I thought that was fixed. Maybe the code broke with another update. I mean, TS4 is very complicated, sometimes things break when they're fixing something else. It's irritating, but it's like that with anything you program, so I wish they had more people for testing and fixing bugs.

[meeshmeesh3]

@PugLove888 Adult sims can also play on the playsets (the spaceship and the pirate ship) if there are already kids playing on it. They act as a sea monster for the pirate ship. I think this is *any* adult sim, not just childish or goofball.

[CircuitD]

I agree, but unfortunately Nap destroyed even the trait preferences since now a music nap will make all sim grab a violin and active nap will make even a couch potato exercise. Yes you can turn them off, which is a solution to all sim bad creations.  And even if it will have a small impact it’s just barely noticeable (playing the guitar will make any sim happy no matter the trait) The game has introduced scared emotion which to me is a great addition and much needed. I don’t need the detail of grabbing a knife from a draw if all those details will slow the game. But, they are crucial animation deficiencies in this game that simply make game play boring. In order to make creating stories and gameplay interesting you need the negative drama. Without that they are just happy clones. My issue is that the game adds negative sentiments and maybe negative lifestyle (don’t get me started on how badly both were designed. I especially have a problem with people person, which is assigned anytime a sim interacts with more then 1-2 sims a day, which in large families and active careers just gets slapped on without legitimate reason). I get negative sentiments without having any animation that would suggest why it happened. Items are just spawning in inventory or get purchased on the computer. That is not game play. Having to watch your sim on a computer is not game play. When something negative happens you just get that sad emotion which is standard for every sim and then has no impact in long term and minimal short term. No matter the trait, circumstance, relationship status the response is alway the same. Reputations are good or bad which basically sums up game play. And at the culmination of it all is lack of animations. In previous sims versions when a sim had an enemy you’d know it. They would occasionally come over and kick a garbage can, you’d get nasty mail, flaming poop, they spontaneously argue if they ran into each other and it was not overwhelming. This game introduces any animation and it gets overloaded to a point it’s more frustrating then fun. Vending machines are always stuck, Murphy bed kill at an alarming rate, thinking of family member is constant. There is no subtlety in the existing animations and positivity overwhelms this game . And, drama is simply missing. Relationships, reputation as limited as they are exist in a panel blurb. That is it. My sim visited her parents and wanted to bake some cookies and got thrown out like a stranger. So what is the point of a family tree or relationships in general if they don’t impact, change or create diversity in game play? When a sim gets caught cheating they get a color. Animation wise nothing really happens or very little. There is no slapping, running away, screaming, very little arguing and it really no different if they would be arguing with a stranger. Actually if the other cheater was a friend they might even remain one and there is no interaction where you can confront the friend. There is no reciprocity. You can’t kick a sim out of the house, ask them to move out. Instead you have to go to narrator mode, breaking any story creation and have the sim removed from the household and moved into another like a piece of furniture in build mode. There are no likes (except drinks I guess), no dislikes, attractions. There is very little diversity in behavior, reputation are sadly nearly missing, traits have little impact, animations are lacking and no reciprocity is provided. You can have a kleptomaniac but can’t catch one stealing. You can ask to represent as an attorney, but after finding our career can’t ask to be represented and this lack of reciprocity is very common. A cop can arrest someone, but a sim can’t be arrested. You can’t introduce one sim to another (this was an interaction available in previous sims), you can’t just hang out. Groups have little activity they will do together. They just scatter all the time. And in most times the animation is missing, but instead you get a color. Every relationship level or title, exists in a profile panel only. 

[SqueamishNerd]

@CircuitD I agree to a lot of those things you're pointing out! I really wish for a lot of those things to be better.

It's sad that the NAPs and lifestyles are still so broken, I just never use them.

I totally agree with that sims should be able to act like they do at home when visiting their parents. Actually, I wish they could act like home at any relatives and best friends. Also, slumber parties would have been a nice addition. It could be a social event where the guests act as they would at home without getting kicked out, so they could cook, shower, sleep etc.

I love the scared emotion, it was a well-needed addition. I love that scared sims can panic and either the other sim will calm them or also get scared, and I love if a sim sleeps while scared they might have nightmares (the nightmare notifications are very funny), and also the detail that their bladder meter goes down faster when they're scared.

Another nice addition is the trait update they recently did. Though I would've wanted them to list all the updates they did, I actually have noticed some changes. I like that genius sims now can "solve hard problems" (or whatever the action is called in English), which raises their logic, and that they sometimes get eureka moments in the shower (which previously was only for Scientist sims to come up with new inventions) which now acts to raise one of their higher skills a tiny bit. I've also noticed that goofball sims prank the toilets autonomously (though I think they're doing it way too often, one of my sims have a partner who's a goofball and she pranks the toilet every time she visits).

About likes, I wish it could be chosen in CAS but that it was optional, and if you choose one it can be changed or removed later without cheats. It could be things like favourite drink (honestly, I don't understand how that one works right now, is it randomised? Is it saved as a hidden trait?), favourite weather (you can choose what weather sims like and dislike by talking to other sims, it's under Friendly, but I would prefer if it was in CAS too), favourite dish, favourite colour, favourite instrument, favourite radio station, favourite TV channel etc etc. So, for example if the sim autonomously turns on the radio they turn on their favourite radio station.

Talking about adding things in CAS. Umbrellas, biking helmets, and indoor slippers should be possible to set in CAS. It's annoying that I have to buy an umbrella stand to pick an umbrella, and it's annoying that a sim with a bike uses different helmet every time they bike, and it's annoying that sims who are in houses where slippers are worn indoors use different slippers every time. Honestly, school uniforms and career outfits should also be possible to set in CAS without cheats. It's annoying that they use a different colour of the Mt Komorebi school UNIFORM ("uni" means "one" or "same") every single day, though I think that one might be a bug, but the umbrella, biking helmets, and slippers are probably oversights.

[jonnydnicholson]

I understand that The Sims 4 isn't 'the perfect game', but this is the case for me, too. However, The Sims 4 does:

1 Sims prepare food on a counter top

2 Slices of pizza do appear

3 Chess pieces do move and the chess, in real life, is as much about thought as movement

4 I thought klepto-sims could steal items

(I'm posting after several updates, so these problems might be resolved by now).

Perhaps there could be more details in the Sims 4 along the lines you suggest, but we're talking about a game that might be more expensive, require more computer power, be slower or some combination of the above.

My ideal game would mean that I could control every sim in the dynasty I create without having to play on a rota basis.

I knew i was buying in to a game based on modern American (well, now, not just American) life to appeal to a mass market which is probably why the political career chooses causes rather than parties. Some of the compromises I make in my 'Plantagenet role play' are;

The Royal Family = 10 of the Military Officer career

Lord High Steward = 10 of the politics career

Lord High Chancellor = 10 of the Judge career

Lord Privy Seal = 9 of the Judge career

Lord Great Chamberlain = 10 of the Administrator career

Lord High Constable = 9 of the Military Officer career

Earl Marshal = 8 of the Military Officer career

Luckily, now that I have the Vampire pack, I can start off the Angevin dynasty - Melusine, Countess of Anjou, is, according to European folklore, to have been of Vampiric nature (https://www.angevinworld.com/blog/the-demon-countess-of-anjou/). Geoffrey could be created as 'Hot-headed' (and two other traits - I think the Snowy Escape trait of 'proper' is a good one for my royal role plays) and have the Successful Lineage aspiration. My Plantagenets also wear red and yellow coloured clothing. I use a few cheats to make Chinon Castle, the Tower of London, Dover and Caernarfon Castles. Sometimes, that the game isn't of my exact requirements enhances the fun for me. When I speak about my Plantagenet game with friends I use the history to help to 'explain' the gaps between the game and the reality. Lord John, Lord of Ireland, allegedly murdered (or ordered the murder of) his nephew, the Duke of Brittany, to become King of England (as well as the other titles) - perhaps this is why (among other reasons) the sims when they move out never have never have children (I only really like playing the royal family and I'm not all that fussed about rota play).

Also, how might they react to the Landgraabs? Part of me thinks they might marry a daughter off to Malcolm. I'm just saying an historical role play doesn't even have to follow the history - a kind of historical fiction. Maybe they would prefer Max Villareal and/or a son to marry one of the Bjorgsen daughters or they might just introduce their children to a completely new character.

I'm interested in hearing about how I can have more than 8 sims per household and play more than one household at a time. This, for me, would be the best change to the current set-up. Still, as I wait, I can build more castles and other interesting buildings.