Cyborgs & Zone Troopers OP

[Marine_CorporaI]

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@KroozaNob wrote:

If rifleman weren't being damaged at all by zone troopers or cyborgs, that would mean they still win, because you can hold a pad for 10 tib against 120.

Again, sending a single anti infantry vehicle unit at them works in their favour, you have to set up multiple units to take them on.

They are terrible when outnumbered, you just have to set that scenario up.

And honestly, most cases where the opponent manages to field these units 

A. It is too late for them to do anything when they hit the field

B. You didn't harass enough your opponent

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That’s the game. You can do the same sending a rifleman onto a pad being held by a tank. Or sending an orca to a pad being held by shockwaves. Or sending a venom to a pad being held by an orca. 

And whether you harassed your opponent enough is irrelevant. I’ve shown proof here with video that no matter how many times you destroy or harass someone’s harvester, they’ll just keep rebuilding another one until the tech comes out. The clever players don’t defend it. They’ll send out a sacrificial laser trooper to stall the first missile. The inexperienced players waste money on defending their harvesters which in turn stalls their ability to produce tech. 

What is relevant here is that units are doing damage to other units that they aren’t supposed to be doing damage to. 

[incia]

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@incia wrote:

What are you guys even talking about, my flamethrowers beat Cyborgs all the time, enemy sends 2 cyborgs to two different launch pads and I simply counter with 2 flamethrowers and I always win. You sure he didn't have in a buggy or venom to aid them? Or you were a lot lower level.

And riflemen suck versus everything, they are scout units hence the 3 vision. Cyborg beat wheels and dogs too.

BTW lasers/rockets beat talon too, should we nerf laser/rockets too? Cause they beat a 30 cost unit?

This game involves a little bit of micro and tactics it's not simply spam counters = win 100%.

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Guess you missed this part.

And talons are anti infantry, but fail to take out a laser that costs less.

And you are way too hard on paper scissor stone here, and using words like "they never do any damage to", yes they do, a sniper can actually kill a tank if given enough time. Everything does damage to everyone unless they are crossed out AKA tanks versus air, orca versus air, slingshots versus ground, these can't attack or even target set targets. But if you can target something then you do damage to them. Just because a zone trooper aren't dedicated infantry killers they still damage them, they just do 50% less damage. And you said a tank don't do ANY damage to a laser/rocket? Are you blind? One shell takes out 1 squad member most of the time, so 5-6 shots kills a rocket/laser squad from a tank. So yes a zone trooper and tank should kill a riflemen squad in 5 shots, 1 shot killing one squad member. Game works as intended.

And btw the latest patch actually nerfed zones/cyborgs versus infantry, so they already got their nerf.

[jackau]

After the change, both zone trooper and cyborg are officially OP, anti infantry weapon is no use against them at all, from shatterer to frame troopers, it breaks the balance in a deck for having a lower cost unit able to counter a high class unit that is weak at certain aspects. 

What I see is spamming of both those units in mid to late game. 

New balance patch must tune their anti infantry capacity down, else the game is no fun and became either a early uni micro management battle or spamming the op units on top of batting lag.

[CakeSpear]

I usually send Riflemen to greet Cyborgs and its works fine as far as i can recollect. Maybe i need to check again.