Re: Plasma Pea still needs a nerf

by asukojo
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Re: Plasma Pea still needs a nerf

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So let's take the standard Chomper in a theoretical 1v1 against every (standard variant) zombie:

 

1) vs Imp: The Chomper can easily deplete the Imp's life bar (which is only 75 points) with a couple chomps if he is gooped. You just have to stay out of range of his gravity grenade, or even bait it out then evade, goop him, then chomp a couple times. If he does the gunspin thing, you goop him then keep chomping at him. Believe it or not, you can actually eat the Imp when he is in that gun spinning move. So the Chomper will usually beat the imp 1v1, and you can even beat his mech if you surprise, goop him, then keep biting the mech from behind.

 

2) vs Super Brainz: Up close the Chomper can probably win 10 1v1's out of 10 against Brainz. His fireball you just dodge, bait out, or goop him before he fires it (then eat). You can also eat him (from underneath the ground) when he is in turbo twister, or you can goop him and eat him (while spinning) from above ground, or plant a spikeweed on him when spinning and it stops him (then free lunch). Chomper basically decimates him up close.

 

3) vs Captain Deadbeard: From far range you just take cover and it's a stalemate; neither player can do anything really. Up close I would estimate a 9 to 1 or an 8 to 2 1v1 matchup of these two characters fighting, in favor of the Chomper. The Chomper's spikeweed, if planted on Deadbeard when he is EITHER in barrel formation or the cannon, literally evaporates the barrel or cannon and traps him in the weed for a free snack. Of course if you try to eat the barrel or cannon, then that is a rookie mistake. All you do to him when on the cannon is stand directly near him then plant a spikeweed to capture him. If he is landing splash damage shots, then you can goop him (with standard purple) to slow his rotation, spin around him a little and plant it from behind. Spikeweeding an EXPERT Deadbeard when in barrel formation can be a little more tricky, but you can always goop then land it. Even a very slight juke move or walk around of the spike weed by an expert will evade in (when in the barrel) because the spikeweed DOES NOT lung forward at all when thrown out, but at best you can use it as a deterrent to prevent him from advancing, wait until he blows up and leaves the barrel, goop, then eat him. Other than Deadbeards two up close tools, you just goop and eat him.

 

4) vs Scientist: A head to head with the Scientist can be close, but I can pretty much just goop and eat him every time, unless he runs up from behind. Even if he does run up from behind, I can still beat him very often because of the health advantage.

 

5) vs Soldier: Pretty easy to beat this guy up close, you just goop and eat him. If you miss, you can always use the dig and you will encounter the same behavior from most average to high level players. They will wait until you get just underneath them and then use the rocket jump. You can actually bait this out, look up in the air to monitor where they land, then collect your snack.

 

6) vs Engineer: Chomper's spikeweed evaporates his turret and ties him up for a snack if you get close. You mostly have to watch out for his sonic grenade, but the Engineer is one of the characters that can beat Chomper in a 1v1. His jackhammer can be tricky to counter, but you just have to goop him and (standard chomp) from the front to kill him with strikes. Trying to eat him while on the jackhammer just eats his jackhammer, then gets you killed.

 

7) vs All Star: You can kill him virtually every time if you land a goop on him up close and eat him. If you try to dig eat him, players often wait for you to get close then football charge after that, but you can bait this. After the charge you might have to bait the imp punt, or freeze him with goop before he does it. If a person plants a tackle shield or starts facing the wall, there is a certain tech they use where they time an imp punt that they throw at the wall (or tackle shield) to bounce off the wall and kill you as you are coming up from the dig. The timing works, but you can bait this out if you see what they're doing. If you bait out that tech, they are out of the imp punt then only have their charge left. Even if they land that charge after a missed imp punt kill, you just goop and have a snack.

 

So just because a Chomper in expert hands will win most 1v1's doesn't mean he needs nerfed because he's actually pretty weak outside of 1v1's... It just means that it's bad to trade with an expert Chomper up close with alot of characters.

Message 11 of 15 (278 Views)

Re: Plasma Pea still needs a nerf

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@IIINCORRUPTIBLE wrote:

All due respect, some people need to learn how to play competitive games... I just recently mastered that character and don't think he needs nerfed at all... There are simply some characters that you cannot trade with if you are one character in a certain spot and the other person is in another certain spot.

 

When someone has a good position with a certain character, you just don't trade with them if you're in a certain spot and you can cut off their firing angle and ignore them.




@IronCatFish47 wrote:

Isn't what all splash peas are supposed to do?

 

Fight from elevated positions to utilize splash damage where they are most effective?  Its doing what it was designed to do.   Is there something the plasma pea is doing besides what all splash peas are designed to do that constitutes a nerf?


 

 

Now that Ad Hominem aside and before this devolves into a who is "better":

It doesn't matter how broad you try to describe a problem at hand as i have specifically mentioned problems. We could also just go to "Citron was fine because Citron did was Citron was supposed to do" or "Frozen Citron was fine because Frozen Citron did was Frozen Citron was supposed to do" or "Rose was fine because Rose did was Rose was supposed to do". Or "the Turbo Twister was fine because the Turbo Twister did was the Turbo Twister was supposed to do" ... and so on.

 

It's actually the same problem i have seen multiple times with Agent Pea. Which is now also less than it was in GW1 (who would have thought), but can still outsnipe a Deadbeard. And given that certain customizations increase the hitbox of characters this should simply not exist.

 

But before i go on it is also important to note that i am talking TT on PC here. Which of course introduces new ways to win with far superior aim. So you may not experience the same issue on console with a controller. But what i have seen and criticize here always revolved around camping Plasma Peas behind cover on elevated positions. With no way to contest that due to the constant duck and cover into max charge shot that even deals a lot of damage when you retreat behind cover. Any way to sneak around was no option. And going in also failed because the charged shot and follow up splash took away too much health. Meanwhile that Pea used charged splash after charged splash to create heaps of bodies. There is literally no other Pea where i have ever experienced that.

Even Fire Pea who greatly profits from elevated positions is suffering from missed shots in a direct battle because its only 10 splash at a much slower fire rate.

 

And yes, if more competent people in my team would have noticed the problem they would have helped me. But instead they just gave away all these points while i ended up in the focus of that Pea.

 

Not to forget they buffed Plasma a while ago because the charge felt less satisfying. Which is ok. But ultimately too much with such a large clip and super fast splash that deals 10 damage each and an easy to use escape skill, which a Future Cactus can not rely on once approached.

So if anyone here tries to tell me that "something just didn't work out" then i ask you guys to first experience what i am talking about here, before jumping to generalized conclusions.

 

"Charged shots now decrease ammo count by 2-3 depending on charge level"

That sentence alone says a lot. And it is no fiction. It is about a change from Future Cactus.

 

It took Popcap ages to acknowledge Husk Hop was too much. They will find out Plasma is as well ... eventually.

Message 12 of 15 (249 Views)

Re: Plasma Pea still needs a nerf

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@Screion

 

The idea of certain players being better at certain video games is a complete given and it has nothing to do with insulting somebody because players trying to figure out how to player are always welcome to ask other players how to do so correctly. I'm not going to read and address your whole post right now (because I didn't read it all), but I gave my opinion on the character, having mastered it already, based on sheer multiplayer/competitive value, in a head to head scenario with nearly 90 other characters that I currently have mastered. I think the Plasma Pea is one of the better Peashooters, but just because he is good doesn't mean he needs nerfed. Again, characters should have their stats adjusted based on science, math, and the opinion of experts -- not an impulsive reaction from people who aren't experienced with the game. This comment is not intended to be insulting, but what I mentioned is the proper way to balance a game...

Message 13 of 15 (245 Views)

Re: Plasma Pea still needs a nerf

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@IIINCORRUPTIBLE wrote:

@Screion

 

The idea of certain players being better at certain video games is a complete given and it has nothing to do with insulting somebody because players trying to figure out how to player are always welcome to ask other players how to do so correctly.[...] Again, characters should have their stats adjusted based on science, math, and the opinion of experts -- not an impulsive reaction from people who aren't experienced with the game. This comment is not intended to be insulting, but what I mentioned is the proper way to balance a game...


What does this have to do with the problem i mentioned? Please elaborate.

Message 14 of 15 (236 Views)

Re: Plasma Pea still needs a nerf

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Looks you've a grudge with a player that plays hide and seek with you and keep killing you with plasma explosion. 

 

If this's happened to me, and I don't think my current character suitable to counter attack, I will change my character to attack him back with different tactic: 

A. Pirate

    1. Use pirate bird attack. Sneak behind him and drop him the bomb follow by shots to ensure the kill. He will be cautious next time.

    2. Use pirate with a sniper from far away. Prepare your shot, when he shows up, snipe him to death.

    3. Use explosion timing with captain cannon.

B. Super Brains

    1. Close in then jump to his location and kick him in the face first so his charge shot is gone, then punch, blast him in the face. 

C. Soldier

    1. Close in, and smoke him out to force him out of that position.

     2. Closed in, then zpg while jump. When plasma is charging, it's slower to move and vision is blurred. It's your advantage.

 

Once you settle your grudge, you can come back to your original character you want to level up.

 

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